Member of the Month

je_t.aime_canard
January, 2025

Online

Welcome to the Newschoolers forums! You may read the forums as a guest, however you must be a registered member to post. Register to become a member today!

HDV vs AVCHD

profile picture
MadSteezin
Posts: 4572 - Karma: 936
I'm looking into getting a Canon HD camcorder, but I wanna know which method of recording is better between HDV (Tape) and AVCHD (Hard Drive)...
Which one renders (like viewing it not the transfer time) faster on your computer?
Which one is better for cold temperatures?
And anything else you can think of?
Jan 6 2009 6:53PM
0 0
profile picture
horner
Posts: 2439 - Karma: 1,578
go with an HDV cam.
Jan 6 2009 8:25PM
0 0
profile picture
LOVELL
Posts: 143 - Karma: 129
hard drive will be eraser to upload but mini dv you can keep the tapes and always have the footage. i went with HD mini dv because its a little less expensive. 
Jan 6 2009 8:45PM
0 0
profile picture
MadSteezin
Posts: 4572 - Karma: 936
Actually I'm looking at the HV30.
Jan 6 2009 9:47PM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61780 - Karma: 124,904
Get HDV, AVCHD is crap IMO.
Jan 6 2009 11:17PM
0 0
profile picture
MadSteezin
Posts: 4572 - Karma: 936
I know but they added an extra workflow or w/e.
Jan 6 2009 11:20PM
0 0
profile picture
shibby
Posts: 7088 - Karma: -19
The best advice you'll get is to go scope out another forum on this topic. Seriously, do it.
Jan 7 2009 12:56AM
0 0
profile picture
Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
Ha evan you should explain why!!!

Well ill do it for you.
I dont necessarily think its crap, but in a way its a bit pricier. To go with AVCHD you will end up spending a little more on the camera for a similar product. Sure it is solid state memory and will hold a 4:2:2 color pull down (where tape cant possibly do that), so you will get better colors, but AVCHD will run at the same data rate as HDV (~23 mbps).
In addition, with AVCHD being solid state memory it also allows you to capture what is considered to be "true progressive" or progressive native frame rates; where as, the only thing a tape knows is 60i, no matter what. Any DV camera is using various pull downs to achieve whatever fps it can.
So AVCHD will actually produce a little better quality shot then HDV; however, it comes at a price that is a significant amount more than some good HDV camcorders.
I apologize if that didnt make sense, its late for me and i just wanted to help.

Hope that helps!

-Bentley
Jan 7 2009 4:11AM
0 0
profile picture
Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
oh and as far as cold temps go...
Any camera will work in cold temperatures.
On the manual of the HVX it claims that its operating temperatures are only down to like 30 degrees F, but I know for a fact that they used those cameras during the Ididorod, where the temps are way below that. So to make a point, it doesnt matter what camera it is, just stalk up on some extra batteries, because they will die faster the colder it gets.
Jan 7 2009 4:15AM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61780 - Karma: 124,904
Yup, just how hv30s and dvxs shoot 24/30p, isn't TRUE progressive, but very close.
Jan 7 2009 5:07PM
0 0
profile picture
Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
Ahh well in a way yes. Costs a little extra, haha. I actually used to own a v1u.
My bad,
They do get the 4:2:2, but the only way is if you are using a hard drive to record to instead of tape.
Tape is what holds them back from achieving that, but since the cameras have the capability to, then once you get a hard drive to record to then they can.
Just thats another 800-1200 dollars though.

Good call.
Jan 7 2009 6:22PM
0 0
profile picture
spqr
Posts: 182 - Karma: 141
Say you go with one of the newer cannon solid state cams that shoot AVCHD, you will get a ton better durability. Any HDD or DV tape is going to have lots of moving parts to break when nasty stuff happens during ski filming. Solid state cams are rock solid and the actually memory is next to impossible to break, while a HDD would easily die from a hard shock.

AVCHD uses a more intesive algorithm, so it produces better quality video at the same data rates as HDV, however the tradeoff is you will need a faster proccessor to edit, or rendering will take longer. If you have the monies, I would go with AVCHD, as it is mp4 (newer, progressive video) while HDV is mp2 (older tech, interlaced video).
Jan 7 2009 8:29PM
0 0
profile picture
ChronicLines
Posts: 951 - Karma: 61
HVX rocks, HPX rocks, therefore I would assume the HMC rocks (haven't played with one yet though).
Jan 8 2009 4:48PM
0 0
profile picture
DwyDwy77
Posts: 27 - Karma: 10
i prefer SxS or P2 but im guessing those are out of your price range
Jan 9 2009 1:52AM
0 0
profile picture
A.0.spin
Posts: 472 - Karma: 186
I am a camera newb as well but kind of looking to get into it. is this one as good as a solid state cam?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16830120289

t is one of newegg's only flash memory hd cams and i am really looking for something that would be durable but not above1500
Jan 20 2009 9:25PM
0 0
profile picture
pompe
Posts: 874 - Karma: 124
The new HV40 will shoot TRUE 24P, it's going to be the last of the series and will likely be released in March
Jan 21 2009 2:07PM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61780 - Karma: 124,904
If it shoots on tape, its not TRUE progressive, its impossible. Tapes ALWAYS shoot interlaces and then the camera combineds the fields to make a "24p" or "30p" shot.
Jan 21 2009 8:25PM
0 0
profile picture
pompe
Posts: 874 - Karma: 124
So, the (quite possibly) last of the HV-series, the HV40, adds just a customizable button and “true” 24p, without the need of pulldown removal. If you already have an HV20 or HV30 and a utility to remove pulldown out of PF24, or you just never shoot in PF24, then there is zero reason to buy this camera


http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2009/01/06/regarding-the-new-canon-cameras/
Jan 22 2009 12:38AM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61780 - Karma: 124,904
Cool, nice copy paste. Tapes can't shoot true progressive, period.
Jan 22 2009 2:55AM
0 0
profile picture
Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
All the new HV40 does is remove a pulldown step for you essential. Instead of having to do it in post the camera does it itself. I assume. Really havent looked into it. This would definitely be a nice feature, since back when i had an HDV camera i realized the pulldown process was annoying, then realized shooting in "24p" was extremely useless while filming action, but there are times when you can use it.
But really there's no possible way to get True progressive on tape. Literally impossible, tapes only know 60i no matter what, thats the extent of their frame rate knowledge.
Jan 22 2009 3:24AM
0 0
profile picture
spqr
Posts: 182 - Karma: 141
That is the extent of standard HDV's particular frame rate knowlage. The tapes in our cameras are a digital medium just like any other digital medium (HDD or SSD), if the camera simply changed the data stream then it would be possible to record progressive frames onto the tape. Tapes very similar to MiniDV are used by many servers to backup all kinds of data. I think the issue here is in the capturing, how does the computer know that the video from the HV40 is progressive when it is expecting a 60i stream. This should be as simple as configureing software correctly to know what it is recording.
Jan 22 2009 9:29PM
0 0
profile picture
Candy
Posts: 1052 - Karma: 176
Hey I heard something about how the AVCHD (hard drives and flash drives) have a higher compression rate that happens in the camera, so the HDV (tapes, like the HV30) will actually get a better picture, because it has a lower compression rate that happens in the camera before it is stored on the Tape/Hard Drive/Flash. So less compressed = higher quality shot.
Jan 22 2009 10:48PM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61780 - Karma: 124,904
Very true, HDV can get better looking shots than avchd.


As for the dude saying your can record progressive on tapes, you have no idea what you're talking about. You can't do it, it is impossible, end of story.
Jan 22 2009 11:16PM
0 0
All times are Eastern (-5)