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October, 2024

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My thoughts on the BUYERS GUIDE...

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skiRay
Posts: 7558 - Karma: 926

ok so i just got mine.. and it was cool and all because i love looking at skis for some reason, and any buyers guide is sick..

but

WTF FREESKIER!!! you only worte a review on like 1/4 the skis you tested.. and some of the things reallly stood out to me in a BAD way. and there is no way this is legit

1) Moment Reno Jib? this is like one of the most hyped and sick park skis out there. and yet, it gets stoke of 6
2) Armada Pipe Cleaner. 7.0 stoke? wtf. its like the best all around park ski out there according to... well.. like everyone (yeah call me wrong i probably am, but it deserver to be = to the AR6 at least)
3) Line Anthem. what the hell is it doing in the all mtn catagory? maybe if you tested it in the park, you'd find that you would have another ski in the top picks.
4) Moment Tahoe. 6.0 stoke ?!?! from what ive heard, its one of the top allmtn skis out there. and people will agree.
5) K2 obSETHed. i also thought this was in the worng category. ask yourself, "does seth morrison ski groomers, or does seth morrison ski cliffs, steeps, and pow?" yeah i thought so... now ask yourself, "why did we put the obSETHed in the all mtn category?"
6) Armada ARV. same response and the tahoe
7) ARG. opiniion, but i thought for sure that this would be in the top pick for pow
8) Line Mothership. almost died when i saw the 6.0 stoke

wow, i guess i know how to complain, but all of this is really bugging me...
and now im thinking to myself, "whether someone likes a ski or not is opinion right?"
the answer is yes. so everyone, dont draw yourself away from the skis that you feel suit you, because they got a bad stoke rating or no review at all.


anyone else kinda have the same view towards all of this?

Aug 20 2008 12:50AM
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MC_POUTINE
Posts: 1380 - Karma: 112
word the buyers guide was supremely bad. i love anthems. pipe cleaners are amazing. freeskier really got it wrong
Aug 20 2008 12:53AM
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dowalibeast
Posts: 3339 - Karma: 207
I haven't seen the issue yet but isn't that the point of a buyers guide?  Those are their opinions and readers can take them or leave them. 

You can't argue opinion...Yes, it may be different than yours but....
Aug 20 2008 12:54AM
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Malcolm
Posts: 15951 - Karma: 9,451
yea you get way more info on gear on here then in any buyers guide IMO
Aug 20 2008 12:55AM
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babujib
Posts: 5039 - Karma: 104
i agree, and last year they had the pipe cleaner as their editors choice so i dunno
Aug 20 2008 12:58AM
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Myfirstname.
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 312
It's not the best buyers guide, but i stilll thought it was much more in depth and informative than the POWDER or SKIING buyers guides.
Aug 20 2008 1:15AM
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Karcher
Posts: 3788 - Karma: 1,934
'cough' still havent gotten mine 'cough cough'
Aug 20 2008 1:27AM
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MadSteezin
Posts: 4572 - Karma: 936
Thats for sure!
Aug 20 2008 1:36AM
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freezed
Posts: 12973 - Karma: 500
buyers guides are kind of lame in general though. not really very informative at all. you can get way more info on a ski by looking around the forums here for a few minutes.
Aug 20 2008 1:52AM
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Nakas
Posts: 248 - Karma: 252
i still never guessed that freeskiier would put the anthems in all mtn thats not subjective thats a mistake
also i wish they used blank top sheets on the skis so the reviewer wouldn't be able to base his review off hype
Aug 20 2008 2:32AM
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MC_POUTINE
Posts: 1380 - Karma: 112
good idea
Aug 20 2008 2:38AM
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STwoops
Posts: 2941 - Karma: 5,126
i want mine
Aug 20 2008 2:39AM
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mike_d
Posts: 503 - Karma: 79
Damn, motherships only got a 6? Does anyone by any chance have a pic of the review for the mothership, or know what they said about it? just curious...
Aug 20 2008 3:00AM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24725 - Karma: 29,944
The buyers guide is always really wrong on some things...

Although, sticking the obsethed in the all mountain category is correct.. its by no means stiff enough to be used for hard, fast, charging in the AK that he does.. besides.. seth really never uses it unless hes just shredding tree pow.

The reno jib is all out incorrect. Based on my own use of the ski, i'd give it at least a solid B for performance.. and that was last years model, which indeed had problems with its material. I'm positive they have worked out the kinks this season, and those skis are off the fucking chain.

The tahoe is another ski that makes no sense to me. aside from the fact that many people think its too stiff for a park ski... its not reallly meant for that.. its 96 underfoot, and its more of an all mountain ripper that can be super stable, and still super light. i think they had retards testing it that had never heard of moment, and didnt get the concept.

The Pipe cleaner? its the same as the last two models from what i understand.. and the buyers guide from freeskier is notorious for lowering the stoke on models if they are the same thing as the previous seasons (IE: They lowered the stoke level on the 08 Rossi Brigade last year to like 8, after the BC WRS from 07 scored a 9.5.. even though they were the same ski)



The anthem should not be in all mountain category.. its just a fatter version of the invader.. same materials through and through.. so that was a mistake for sure...



I wish they did a more in depth test, with more riders... of more prestige... not just 35+ year old retards thinking they could do park, or testing skis based on how they "carve" like how some of these geartests are done.

I dont give a shit how a ski carves... does it wash out easy, and is it stable... is it soft or stiff, etc..
Aug 20 2008 3:15AM
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steezyjibber
Posts: 15967 - Karma: 11,026
jea i read that the urban punx got a lower stoke/playfulness (i think) then the STL.

i dont believe so.
Aug 20 2008 8:07AM
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Steezy_Street
Posts: 833 - Karma: 161
I donno if im blind but there is a lack of the Kung Fujas..... If its there pweeese tell me the page number haha. I looked pretty hard tho
Aug 20 2008 8:21AM
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freeskibum82
Posts: 6355 - Karma: 5,055
i personally thought it sucked as well.. They are getting worse and worse each year.

who cares if you can give us a poster with 238905734987 skis... you only wrote real reviews of a select few. Skiing Magazine did a better job.

also.. who designs the damn layout.. there are ads on pretty much the right page throughout the whole magazine.. whats the reason for that?

their goggle choices sucked and so did the apparel.. they even go so lazy that they typed J: for Jacket and P: for Pants.. no description, no waterproof ratings or for what temp/season they would be good for.. just that they liked that color cause "oakley undeniably produces some of the coolest winter threads..."

harvey... im disappointed this year..

Aug 20 2008 8:31AM
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SkierX
Posts: 16253 - Karma: 538
I haven't gotten my issue yet, hopefully it will come today.

The biggest flaw in ski reviews is that it is all subjective and it all depends on how the reviewer feels. I've skied skis that some people adore, but I hated. The Public Enemy comes to mind here.

Instead of the subjective, "this ski rocks!", give me some facts. Tell me about how it carves, how it performs in powder, it's stiffness and other factual things that would help in choosing a ski.
Aug 20 2008 8:43AM
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Ryno
Posts: 31125 - Karma: 336
But all of that is subjective as well. One ski might carve harder then another but that's all in context to what the rider has ridden previously (he might have demoed EHP's first then moved onto MSP's which 'carve hard' compared to EHP's).

Hopefully the NS product guide coming out this fall will have a way around that ;)

Aug 20 2008 8:56AM
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schmies
Posts: 2032 - Karma: 511
Really? What do you think he uses when he is on big ass peaks, magic? He skis the same skis you get in a store. We grab them right out of a box and send them to Seth. He tried a pair of his at the end of this last season with some more rocker to test drive them, but otherwise he uses his ski.
Aug 20 2008 9:04AM
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SkierX
Posts: 16253 - Karma: 538
It's not NEARLY as subjective as a simple rating and a quick talk about the graphics.

The biggest problem with buying skis is the lack of the ability to try before you buy. It seems like there are few worthwhile demos around. You really have to take the word of others and hope you agree once you buy it, which is unfortunate since many of the reviews are vague.
Aug 20 2008 9:05AM
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Armanzoid
Posts: 2453 - Karma: 26
Hahahah, the magic line made me laugh.
Aug 20 2008 9:10AM
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skiRay
Posts: 7558 - Karma: 926
anything below a stoke of like 8.0, didnt even get a damn rewiew.. just a picture with the sized and dimensions next to it. thats part of why im complaining
Aug 20 2008 9:16AM
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grams.
Posts: 7406 - Karma: 186
Yep, it pretty much sucked. It was just eye candy basically. I was looking forward to a review on the reno jib. Also, so many damn ads.
Aug 20 2008 9:18AM
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skiRay
Posts: 7558 - Karma: 926
oh yeah also, The Kung-Fujas? i thought this was almost the exact ski as the Seth Pistol... aka, one of the best all mtn skis ever made. so...

and something else i noticed: in past years the public enemy has always had good things to be said about it, but it was never a top pick. now all the sudden the extreme is in the top above the jib? i know its a sick park ski, and that its underrated, and that a lot of people think it sucks because its a bit heavier than most park skis... or that its a newb ski (well they dont mount it center). sick ski, im glad they liked it
Aug 20 2008 9:22AM
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SkierJulie
Posts: 2495 - Karma: 101
A buyer's guide is subjective. A bunch of people go out for a few days and ski as many skis as possible. Then, they report back with their thoughts. Sounds like you just called out skis you think are the bomb, but that Freeskier gave a less than optimal review to. But, have you actually skied them? If not, you have no basis for saying things like you heard they are awesome. And, just because a ski has gotten a lot of hype doesn't necessarily mean it actually rides that well. (Not pointing to any specific ski as I haven't ridden many of them.)
Aug 20 2008 9:24AM
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bpalmer
Posts: 2408 - Karma: 93
nah ive seen him, he uses magic.
Aug 20 2008 9:38AM
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ski_DC
Posts: 1347 - Karma: 58
i havent even gotten mine yet, but i have been noticing a downward trend in their buyers guides over the last few years. i loved the 06/07 one, because it had reviews for all the skis, boots, bindings, and clothes that were pictured. last years was very lacking in my opinion, what with only a few suits reviewed and the same thing for boots. this year doesnt sound much better. come on Freeskier, you can do better.
Aug 20 2008 10:15AM
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keystoneandbone
Posts: 187 - Karma: 15
most of the skis were never tested they just wrote the size,brand and price then the stoke was based off what brand and the graphic. we sent them our illusion ski to test and they didnt even post it in the buyers guide and its in my opinion our best pair of skis in years.
Aug 20 2008 10:31AM
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SlickRick.
Posts: 4329 - Karma: 300
funny part is, in my preNS days i would live and die by what the buyers guide said, along with a little imput from senseless salesmen.
Aug 20 2008 10:57AM
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IrideWI
Posts: 2882 - Karma: 316
I WANT MY BUYERS GUIDE!!!!
Aug 20 2008 11:14AM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,686
arn't there like 5 threads on this. what about completly forgeting to Review the EP pros? oh and the Powder one atleast said something about every ski. the freeskier guide did not even bother to tell you the flex on most of the skis.
Aug 20 2008 11:32AM
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pretzels
Posts: 416 - Karma: 43
1) Moment Reno Jib? this is like one of the most hyped and sick park skis out there. and yet, it gets stoke of 6
2) Armada Pipe Cleaner. 7.0 stoke? wtf. its like the best all around park ski out there according to... well.. like everyone (yeah call me wrong i probably am, but it deserver to be = to the AR6 at least)
3) Line Anthem. what the hell is it doing in the all mtn catagory? maybe if you tested it in the park, you'd find that you would have another ski in the top picks.
4) Moment Tahoe. 6.0 stoke ?!?! from what ive heard, its one of the top allmtn skis out there. and people will agree.
5) K2 obSETHed. i also thought this was in the worng category. ask yourself, "does seth morrison ski groomers, or does seth morrison ski cliffs, steeps, and pow?" yeah i thought so... now ask yourself, "why did we put the obSETHed in the all mtn category?"
6) Armada ARV. same response and the tahoe
7) ARG. opiniion, but i thought for sure that this would be in the top pick for pow
8) Line Mothership. almost died when i saw the 6.0 stoke


yo man whats up just got my buyers guide to and definately agree with stuff lots of people are saying about them not writing about a lot of skis but i want to respond to some of your list here goes,
1) moment reno jib - maybe the testers didnt like em. who cares if its "one of the most hyped and sick park skis out there" hype doesnt mean anything dude i think its more about performance. not sayin i skied em, but just becasue a lot of ns people say good things doesnt mean its a good ski.
2) armada pipe cleaners - i think the stoke rating is out of 10, doesnt that make 7 a good score? if it got a 3 or 4 i would be pissed cuz armada is so sick. but 7 doesnt seem bad it seems good but not perfect.
3) line anthem --- dude why the fuck did they put it in all mtn. LOL omg that was so dumb couldnt agree more
4) moment tahoe, this is the 2nd moment ski that got a review of 6..calling them average doesnt mean their bad, it just means that their good but not as good as some others. i mean you cant expect a company to come out of no where and be as good as line or k2 or armada the 1st season can you?
5) i thought cliffs, steeps, and pow are all mtn??? dont know too much about that stuff living in maryland but my girlfrned ski out west and she says that theres a lot of that stuff all over the mnts. kinda confused there.
6), 7), 8) = you cant trash the opinions of tons of testers (like 100 i think) because you think the skis should get better scores. not sure if you tried all these skis, but i know i have not, so that makes these testers way smarter than me.

not saying FREESKIER knows wahts up, cuz they do kinda bad lot of things (anthems), but what i am saying is that these testers know more than us, because they review each ski over a whole week and get to ski them way before the hype on ns starts talking bad or good things about em.
Aug 20 2008 12:34PM
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ssk
Posts: 1308 - Karma: 697
just cause a ski is hyped up doesnt mean the testers are gonna like it or rate it high for that matter

if you think that they did something wrong than go with your opinion and still buy the skis...there doing there best to inform the uninformed
Aug 20 2008 12:34PM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24725 - Karma: 29,944
From everybody that has skied them, the moment reno jib has been pretty fucking good... This season they worked out all the kinks from last season (their first season they produced them) and they should be flawless.

the cleaners have gotten huuuge stoke in the past.. and seeing as they are the same ski as years past, they are subject to lower stoke for some reason. Freeskier has the weird ability to hate new stuff, and hate old stuff even more.. I really dont get it.

The moment tahoes have been around for a while, and they really are a bomb ski. If you like a superlight, stiff ski that leans more into the stiff all mountain quiver stick category, then thats a ski you might wanna try.


Finally, these testers DONT know more than us, the ARE us to an extent. This is newschoolers dude... This is where the guys from Freeskier magazine CAME FROM. The trouble is, they might have forgotten that, or something to that extent...



or they really are us, and just got SUPER lazy, and just started putting bullshit numbers by the skis they werent really wiling to try, and gave a number based on what they thought of the graphics or something hahaha. I would understand that completely...
Aug 20 2008 1:03PM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24725 - Karma: 29,944
I say for next year...

They go out, and tests skis from at least 3 different parts of the country...

-East Coast
-Rockies
-Pacific

Then, they use US, the roots of where that magazine came from to do the test. Put out some application thing, with a video of your skiing as to why you think you think you should be able to test skis etc etc etc, and then, give a bunch of newschoolers random skis that are whitesheeted (meaning the bases and topsheets are all white, and you dont know what the fuck the skis are) and see which skis turned out the best.

Then from there.. we can compare which skis are east coast skis... colorado/utah skis.. etc...

3 stoke ratings on every ski would be brilliant... i'm surprised nobodys thought of it yet... especially when theres so many different places and conditions.
Aug 20 2008 1:07PM
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pretzels
Posts: 416 - Karma: 43
dude 4 real? i have never seen a moment ski in stratton, okemo, sunday river, and wisp last year. glad you like them. i bet their a dope ski, but, you think they should be flawess, others dont share your thought. sorry dude thats how stuff goes

pipe cleaners and freeskier being weird about hating new stuff and old stuff. dont reall know what your talking about if they make a buyers guide they diefinitely dont hate new stuff

dude the testers DO know more than us. they skied every ski and we HAVE NOT. how are we more qualified to talk about these skis? cuz of hype or how the graphics look? or we like the pro riders? that is just dumb. freeskier  didn't come from NS. 1 guy did and his name is matt harvie.


Aug 20 2008 1:19PM
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pretzels
Posts: 416 - Karma: 43
i dont ski so many skis but i know i can tell if a ski is good or not based on a run. you dont need like a year to test a ski, skis get worse with age not better
Aug 20 2008 1:30PM
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MC_POUTINE
Posts: 1380 - Karma: 112
bents i think
Aug 20 2008 1:30PM
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MC_POUTINE
Posts: 1380 - Karma: 112
i would disagree with that. i hate new skis becuase becuase they havnt grown into their pop yet
Aug 20 2008 1:31PM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24725 - Karma: 29,944

Dude.. I dont think they are flawless. I think they are GOOD but not flawless, and should probably be rated higher than that. i'd give them more like an 8, personally. Also, they have quite a presense on the east coast. Just look at Cedric Fourney bro! kids slayin it up in quebec, and on the east coast, and from my understanding, thats his ski of choice.

I'm not saying its the fucking best thing on earth.. hell, i dont even work for moment or anything.. i just say that it probably DOES deserve more respect in comparison to other skis in the same category (the high 80's, symmetrical park ski category)

Every single time theres a fucking ski thats the same as the previous year, freeskier lowers the stoke. Just look at the Rossignol BC WRS from 2 years back. That thing got a stoke of 9, or 9.5, and was ranked one of the best skis, and an editors pick, etc etc etc. the next year, rossi makes the same ski, it has a different graphic, and yet its stoke goes down to like 7 or 8 or something? how the FUCK does that happen bro? Same with the cleaners. They had one of the highest stokes EVER a few years back, and look at them now. They are basically the same ski. So its kinda odd.

On the opposite end.. with new stuff, they tend to give crappy ratings as well. Last year the hellbent recieved a 7, and the EP pro recieved something less than that, and the ARG was like an 8.5, for some silly reason. I myself have skied all three, and in powder, which these things are MADE for... all 3 of those skis should be getting at least a 8.5 overall rating. (note, i'm speaking of last years guide not this years as an example)


Go into Geartalk bro. Guys on here know their shit. We work in shops.. we've skied on different skis for years.. we have broken skis, we have won skis etc etc etc. Many pros have COME from this site directly. A lot of people are more than qualified to talk about skis, ski on these skis, etc. We arent ALL a bunch of retarded 15 and 16 year olds who think graphics are what its all about or something.. cmon.. give us more credit for who we are.

(by the way.. learn to spell his name right)

Aug 20 2008 1:32PM
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pretzels
Posts: 416 - Karma: 43
strange never really seen that before... how long does it take?
Aug 20 2008 1:33PM
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B-runge
Posts: 16558 - Karma: 361
me neither
maybe they dont like idaho so they ship here last.
Aug 20 2008 1:41PM
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miroz
Posts: 10333 - Karma: 3,945
Dude, thats exactly what Dingo Sean was talking about above.  He says they can't tell a good/bad ski any better than we can...

And I agree, I was disappointed.  Weaksauce, Harvey...although the girl at the beginning of the ski section had big ol boobies.
Aug 20 2008 1:49PM
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pretzels
Posts: 416 - Karma: 43
cedric is sick but he is a pro rider... dont really think that counts when it comes to seeing skis around cuz he gets paid to ride em.

freeskier gives them a 7 you want them at an 8. the change is so small bro. lowering stoke from year to year: ski companies change, more companies make better skis that are simlar. so, if a ski like hte BC rossignonl WRS stands out one year as an incredible ski... the next year the exact same ski wouldn't do as well. it is crazy to think they would. other ski companies caught up and made skis similar so it puts the WRS in a lower rating category. I'm sure when the 1st line twin tip came out everyone was really stoked on them, but now not so much. why? cuz technology changes and all skis (not just a single model or brand) get better. with so many skis getting better it puts the skis that are once the exception into the average category because compared to the others they do just about the same things. think about that with the pipe cleaner and remember that skis got better and the pipe clearner (still a super cool ski) is not the best skis in the park but one of the many best skis in the park. that's like saying, "everyone thought teddy bear crisis was the best ski movie 3 years ago but now thinks there are better ones"

for the rocker skis not really sure what's up with them getting low ratings cuz everyone in the movies uses them now but someone before in this post thread said something like the pros have 1/2 a day to ride the ski. so what if powder didnt fall on that day and they had to ski them on groomers? doesnt that make for bad turns if your on powder skis?

oh and geartalk is good thats where i hear about a lot of new skis coming out and stuff and it does agood job. but gearuide by freeskier is cool cuz it gives you all the pictures with some stuff about the ski (even tho its not the best)



Aug 20 2008 1:55PM
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miker92
Posts: 621 - Karma: 36
i think since you live in the east you have a different idea of an "all mountain ski." you're picturing like 75-85 waist k2 apaches and volkl ac's and other directional "all mountain" skis. i think freeskier's take is that their all mountain category has some of the best skis for doing a little bit of everything, from pow to park to trees etc. if you can only afford one pair of skis, it doesnt hurt if those skis are awesome at more than just park.
Aug 20 2008 1:56PM
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Duncan*
Posts: 1270 - Karma: 164
no but i think hes talking that they have thier facts WRONG like i think he is saying that u should ride the skis for the terrian example anthem y are they in the all mountain catagorey
Aug 20 2008 2:02PM
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DCepTiKoN402
Posts: 617 - Karma: 28
Im pretty sure the park ski testers are NSer's (for the most part). Looking through the photos reveals Matt Walker, Andrew Hathaway, Josh Bishop, Josh Malcyk, and so on....



Also I think a lot of "bad" stoke ratings stem from the companies creating park skis for the "consumer" (which they should). They want the consumer to "feel like a pro" on a ski so they create forgiving/playful skis. That turns into pros and top ams testing skis that are unpreforming noodles that they can easily over power which equals a bad rating.

Just my opinion on the Park Ski Test but if you look at the park ski Editors Picks they're all on the stiffer side of things.

Also personally Im pumped none of the Rockered park skis got "reviewed". Who the fuck wants a rockered park ski? The only advantage would be buttering. I ride my rocker pow skis in the park every once in awhile and while it's defienently fun it's not what is all cracked up to be.


Aug 20 2008 2:33PM
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tahoeskier
Posts: 372 - Karma: 433
Cmon! Everyone knows buyers guides are for gapers! All they are really good for is getting a splash at the trends and graphics for the year.
Aug 20 2008 2:49PM
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joly.sp
Posts: 2305 - Karma: 585
Last Years buyers guide was so much better....
I did some counting and last year they reviewed the skis by brand and was much easier to follow.
Last years they had 155 skis reviewed WITH a little write up about each one.
This year they had 50 skis with write ups......

Also they didnt have the jumps, rails, all mt., playfulness rating. They just give it a stoke and call it done. They give the Anthems a 5.5 and no reasoning behind it, and no freeskier it's a park ski.

I have subscribed for the first time to freeskier and this was my first issue and im pretty dissapointed. Hopefully the real mags dutring the year arent this bad
Aug 20 2008 3:04PM
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pavel
Posts: 200 - Karma: 18
psst... freeskier gets paid off
Aug 20 2008 3:13PM
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