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October, 2024

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Camp media

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freestyler540
Posts: 13083 - Karma: 18,726
Is it me, or the camps are so focused on getting pro skier as coaches? All the videos and pics I have seen about camps only show pro skiers doing really cool things and camp members are the audience. I have yet to see a vid showing a camp member showing progression, or even more, a coach who is really coaching a camper.


Jul 3 2008 9:09PM
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freezed
Posts: 12973 - Karma: 500
I think that's just because showing some random kid's first 3 or 5 or something isn't that exciting for other people to watch. I dunno. The coaches do coach, they set goals with the kids, or they all learn backflips one day, or stuff like that. I just think that stuff isn't what the camps want to show in their updates/edits/photos/etc because it isn't impressive looking. Just my take on it.
Jul 3 2008 9:16PM
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scofield
Posts: 7973 - Karma: 2,467
so you'd rather watch a camper try a shitty 360 than watch your favorite pro at a summer camp you wish you were at do a steezy rodeo 9? i think it would get pretty old to watch a coach twist his body on camera trying to teach kids to do 3's, rather than seeing what the coaches can teach you and what coaches you have to teach you.

why wouldnt you want really really good pros as your coaches?
Jul 3 2008 9:17PM
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freestyler540
Posts: 13083 - Karma: 18,726
Its because being a pro does not mean being a good coach. I am not disrespecting anyone in any way. But, like the kids are paying big bucks, they should have a part in the promo vids, while showing coaches doing their job. For me, the camps credibility would increase.

We see pros doing really cool things, that is their job. But, I feel it would be more interesting featuring the athletes in the spot light and not the coaches. I was a mogul coach, I learnt to take a step back and make the athletes shine for once. When an athlete shines, the coach shines with him...maybe not obviously.
Jul 3 2008 10:12PM
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freezed
Posts: 12973 - Karma: 500
I actually do agree with you, I was just explaining from the camp's perspective.
Jul 3 2008 10:50PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
yep, I would like to see more about the campers.  make it  50/50 mix
Jul 3 2008 11:13PM
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fillup
Posts: 4904 - Karma: 568
The coaches are really good, you either had a chill coach and just learned at your leisure and skied or had an intense coach and learned alot, both had their perks.
Jul 3 2008 11:16PM
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mski
Posts: 4791 - Karma: 3,803
Yah there has been a lot of pro exposure in all the edits, all amazing footage of some really talented skiers. But, for example, when COC releases a summer session A edit and about 75% of the footage is of one skier wheres the fun in that for the people who went to camp and threw down. From my own experience at camps there are a lot of campers who throw down just as hard as the coaches that deserve to be filmed to show the over all camp experience. Maybe not a "shitty 360" but Im sure most campers aren't all doing that all day. If i went to camp id love to see a well edited edit of footy of me and fellow campers. I'm not saying leave the pros out, Im saying give the campers a chance.
Jul 3 2008 11:26PM
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stormtrooper
Posts: 1191 - Karma: 461
i hope i have a drill coach who wont let me stop until i land my trick
Jul 3 2008 11:26PM
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casual
Posts: 6712 - Karma: 6,748
You make a good point. If a session vid's goal is to attract campers, you'd think there'd be some footage of the coaching experience. I've never been to camp and frankly I have no clue what the experience is like, despite having watched every edit. It'd be dope to watch some of the best riders throw down in person, but I don't know that it's worth a few grand to pole clap while Sammy stomps a flat 5. I'd like to see an edit of some kid trying to 270 onto a flat box a dozen times, getting some pointers, and then stomping it and claiming the shit out of it. I think there's definitely a bit of a conflict of interest with having up and coming/established pros doing the bulk of the coaching. If I was pro and had the opportunity to ride the best parks in the world all summer long....I may be focused on my personal progression and my attention to campers could suffer. I've heard kids on this site shit all over Peter O. for his coaching habits, or lack there of. I say only let the old washed up pros coach who have zero chance at taking a podium. On second thought, Peter what are you up to this summer? Kidding, kidding.
This is not a knock on any coaches, and I repeat: I've never been to camp. It sounds like kids are progressing a ton and having a blast while doing it. It would be nice to see some stoked ass kids throwing down though.

Current or former campers...... Who are some of the best coaches?
Jul 3 2008 11:45PM
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skimanskimanskim
Posts: 1515 - Karma: 1,715
I very much see where your coming from. Much insight from you
Jul 4 2008 10:55AM
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scofield
Posts: 7973 - Karma: 2,467
dude, i dont get paid to film campers. and as a matter of fact i do, i have plenty of camper footage but its frowned upon by the bosses to throw random clips in without names, i cant get names of every camper and no one knows every camper. I'm tryin to incorporate coaching into my videos but that was my first week here, not knowing anyone. the 75% thing must refer to gus, and gus is a Stept athlete who was one of the only ones throwing down ridiculously hard so i could get footage to even put together an edit. If a camper comes up to me and asks me to film a trick he's learned that looks good, ill film it, but no one says anything so ill film those who want me to and want to be filmed, while of course completing my job description.

i dont make the contract
Jul 4 2008 11:09AM
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scofield
Posts: 7973 - Karma: 2,467
again, you cant sit at a flat box all day with your camera and film some kid learning 270s, you'll miss half the footage you couldve got that day, and they may not even land it!

Joe Schuster, coach of the year.
Jul 4 2008 11:12AM
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-Ward-
Posts: 52 - Karma: 719
if you watch the COC session A edit there are a bunch of campers. Campers take up the whole first half of the movie. the coaches dont come in until the end
Jul 4 2008 11:18AM
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freestyler540
Posts: 13083 - Karma: 18,726
I know that the guys that run this business whats to have the best coaches and good vids. But, maybe talk to the guys, make them understand that some campers deserve to have exposure too. The point of a camp is to have a great time and learn new things, not look at pros all day long (what I get from seeing the promo vids).

Getting quality vid, is a job in itself. Even if the vid is unappealing, it is an awesome tool to point out mistakes. So any vid is better than no vid. And the videos that look good can be used on promos. Stannding with a cam sucks, I know. But, if a session develops you get to have fun too. Take turns videotaping, give some inspiration and get back behind the lens.
Jul 4 2008 12:10PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
Dude!  Tell your bosses - I will edit your post (or any other mod) to include a name, when someone goes, HEY! thats me!

Come on man, camp is the highlight of these skiers season.  What a better way to memorialize it!  A camper getting his shot in an update?! its the ultimate in feel good stuff.  Take this how you will, I think you are little, just little bit full of yourself.

I know my son is there with a ton of friends, I would rather see them than the same pros we see all season long.  Let the pros do/have their own photo shoots. 

Summer camp is for campers..  Let the updates reflect that in a fair porportion.

This is my opinion and no one elses...


Jul 4 2008 12:12PM
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K-Thomas
Posts: 2700 - Karma: 604
eh i'll try and embed this bitch...prob not gonna work.



Windells Session 2
Jul 4 2008 12:16PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
hell fuckin yeah KT!  now that is what I am talking about!   Who filmed and edited that please?
Jul 4 2008 12:25PM
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scofield
Posts: 7973 - Karma: 2,467
full of myself? that hurts papa, im one of those friends who has been skiing with nips (now stipples) everyday he's been here, i even let holson use my camera to film him when i wasn't.

none of you are in my position and dont understand my job. im trying to make everyone happy, no need to rag
Jul 4 2008 12:35PM
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SEskier
Posts: 570 - Karma: 115

there are a ton of campers that throw down hard in every session, but i've only seen a small number in the edits and updates so far.  momentums setup on the glacier is geared towards the diggers and coaches too much jump wise.  they are 3 small jumps and then the huge ones in the high north lane. very few of the campers even hit the step down when i was there and a handful spun on the step up and there were some pretty good kids a session 2.  they have no in between for learning and smaller consequence jumps. 

camp is for campers, they should build there park with that moto in mind.

Jul 4 2008 12:42PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
You know what?  the more I think about this the more I want to rant. 

This is the fourh year I have followed these summer camps on an almost hourly basis. This is also the 4th year I have paid through the nose for to send my kid(s) to camp. Ask Holson how miffed I am with only the bill to look at.

Parents who pay for these camps want to see pics and media.  tell your boss that!

I am sure that none of the campers want to see themselves and their crappy tricks.  Nope they weren't at the camp, they didn't see the pros that were there throwing down, they want to come home and see the pros, not themselves.

Kids who ask, I can only throw a 3, am I good enough to go to camp?  Wonder where they get that from?

Nope it sounds like the media being created from these camps is supposed to be quality riding and editing. What is this?  A edit contest or something?

Rant over.
Jul 4 2008 12:49PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
Dude - so that I am not misunderstood.  I know of you and think you and your work is awesome. Do not get me wrong here.  I am raggin at the direction that you have been put under. I do understand. 


Jul 4 2008 12:51PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
I think summer just got to me..  sorry for all the bitchy posts..  BTW as I have commented in the updates.  The updates this year are the best ever.  I am just picking probably cause I am not there.  sorry.
Jul 4 2008 1:14PM
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K-Thomas
Posts: 2700 - Karma: 604
not sure who filmed/edited it, was featured on freeskier.  that last section w/ the rodeos/flats was awesome. seeing how stoked not only the kids were, but how stoked tom and hornbeck were for them was so sick. i think this is my favorite edit from camp so far this year, and it clearly didnt have the most pros, or for that matter best tricks but i thought it showed what camps are supposed to be about.
Jul 4 2008 1:42PM
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freestyler540
Posts: 13083 - Karma: 18,726
That is what I am talking about. That was fucking great
Jul 4 2008 2:32PM
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danetudor
Posts: 178 - Karma: 1,325
most of the kids want to hit big jumps man. those jumps are intermediate sized jumps. there are plenty of different sized jumps at momentum for all skill levels. i dont know what ur talking about man.
Jul 4 2008 7:10PM
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SEskier
Posts: 570 - Karma: 115
when i was there for session 2 there was the super poppy 50 footer or the 20 some thing one on the bottom. then there was the huge step down (that very very few people hit while i was there) and the really nice step over/up.  i like to hit big jumps too but there wasn't really any in between jumps.  i liked the looks of the last jump mentioned, but never got to hit because i fractured a vertebrae and left early.  i was just hoping that momentum would bring back high norths big booter lane.  three smooth 40 footers in a row would be prime. i was dissapointed with what momemtum did with that lane.
Jul 4 2008 7:27PM
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casual
Posts: 6712 - Karma: 6,748
exxxxactly....dope. 
Jul 4 2008 7:41PM
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mski
Posts: 4791 - Karma: 3,803
yah that was dope!
Jul 5 2008 2:05AM
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SirFryanator
Posts: 11149 - Karma: 1,415
don't worry windells session 4...we should have a crew of cameras there ranging from shitty to dope. so be prepared to get filmed!
Jul 5 2008 2:49AM
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CampofChampions
Posts: 205 - Karma: 4,400
Hey guys, stoked to here some feedback on the camp videos.  We'll tweak our videos based on what you guys want to see. Filming is not an easy job, you need to be on point for all the rad sessions that pop up everywhere over the course of the day and also get the campers filmed when they are throwing down.  It's not easy, but our guy is killing it and will get all the footy everyone wants to see.

Camp is all about the campers.  We don't build the terrain park we have just for the pros, we build what the campers want to ride first and then throw in what the pros want with the space we have left.  It's important for the pros to be able to throw down on features that are suitable for them as well.  Seeing the pros thrown down right in front of you is so different from watching it in a movie and is also an important motivator for the campers to get stoked and take their sking to the next level.  It's a fine balance and your feedback is vital to getting it right.

So hit us up and call us out when you feel you need to.  Camp is for you, so you have every right to ask for what you want and we'll do everything we can to try and accommodate it.
Jul 5 2008 12:45PM
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ssk
Posts: 1308 - Karma: 697
videos like that windells one are videos that make me regret not draining my bank account to go to one....that is the best  way to promote your camp right there
Jul 5 2008 12:56PM
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Jwenz
Posts: 8893 - Karma: 7,633
you people are crazy. I know there is only one skier Filmer on the glacier or so i believe that to be Connor. I am absolutely positive that he is hustling around to get as much footage as he can. He literally can't be every where at one time and not everyone will be filmed when they are doing their best tricks, its unfortunate.

I know for fact when I went to camp that camp is not all about the coaches. I know when I see them throw down it really makes me want to try new stuff. And when they aren't throwing down they are definitely and i mean FOR CERTAIN teaching kids new things. And what they do is tell kids what to do then hit shit and watch their campers. So if Scofield is getting shots of the coaches it could be before or after they have coached their campers new tricks, which happens very often. For example...I was at high north ski camp two years ago and PETER OLENICK was my coach...he was referenced above...and he honestly was the best coach I had all week long by far. He really pushed me to learn 7's while he himself was learning new tricks. And when any coach is still learning and practicing the motivation of myself was so much higher. I know I fell on most if not all of my 7's which became 9's and 10's but who cares. He was helping me the entire time regarless if he too was hitting jumps

Just chill out people..not everyone will get filmed especially in a camp of 200+ campers..i think COC has that many sorry if wrong.

END RANT


Jul 5 2008 1:27PM
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casual
Posts: 6712 - Karma: 6,748
  Thanks Camp Of Champions, good to know that you guys are so responsive and appreicative of feedback.  I feel like some feathers have been ruffled...I don't think that was anyone's intentions in this thread.  All of the filmers are killing it...and I speak for everyone when I say we love all the footy and edits.  We simply wanted to have a better look at the camp experience from a coaching/learning perspective.  I appreciate the limitations and logistics, this wasn't meant to be overly critical. 
Jul 5 2008 1:44PM
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EClay46
Posts: 2499 - Karma: 69
there were 3 lips on the bottom jump at momentum, 1 pretty small where you could learn to jump, then the medium was perfect for learning stuff, and the middle wasnt even that big. last session they got 2 more jumps put in where the wallride pad was and they were great for kids to learn to spin on, after that there was another small jump under where the old tent was
Jul 5 2008 2:48PM
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SEskier
Posts: 570 - Karma: 115

^^^well that's good. i was just dissapointed there weren't more jumps and that i never got to hit the step up. the rails were a lot of fun though.

Jul 5 2008 3:04PM
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WhoWantIt
Posts: 395 - Karma: 26
I spun over the step up. *CLAIM*
I had to, it was too sick not to claim.
Jul 5 2008 3:11PM
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Kevski
Posts: 7056 - Karma: 2,785
I just got back from momentum, and I can tell you that there are both sides. There were some coaches that really didn't coach at all, to the point where the groups just ditched the coach and sessioned by themselves.However, pretty much all of my coaches helped me out tons. I had a bunch of older coaches and some younger ones, and I don't think that mattered at all. I learned shitloads.

About the filming, there was only one filmer, and there were a couple days where we didn't get filmed at all. We never had a whole bunch of one thing filmed except on the first day. Filming really wasn't a priority for them.
Jul 5 2008 3:24PM
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quebecfreestyler
Posts: 13040 - Karma: 1,419
I am so impressed by how the COC crew is working on changing features on a dayly basis so the kids can do stuff on different stuff.

I tried to hang around some campers/coach this past week to gather some footage of kids learning new stuff.
All the campers I talked to this week are stoked on being here and learning that much stuff in only a week.


I dont know if people understand how crazy big the coc park is. There is just so much going on at the same time that it isnt easy to show what is going on in a park that have 2 rail lines, 2.5 jump lines, a pipe, a quater pipe and a little rail garden.

Scoffield is trying his best to please everyone here and I hope you get to try the whole COC experience. Everyone here is trying to help you getting better at the sport you love and the facilities are just amasing.



Jul 5 2008 5:28PM
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mmallender.
Posts: 5805 - Karma: 936
the point about coaches trying to progress themselves, in my experience, when a coach is trying to learn something new themselves they think about the fundamentals and all the small things it takes to learn something new, which is often much more helpful than a coach who knows how to do something, but not explain how to break it down step by step. This of course is assuming that the coach is trying to learn something that has some sort of relation to what you are trying to learn, and they are willing to give you the time of day.
Jul 5 2008 5:45PM
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CampofChampions
Posts: 205 - Karma: 4,400
Sorry to bring this back up, busy day yesterday with the departure of B campers and arrival of C campers.  You guys can critique us all you want, no feathers will ever get ruffled here.  We're stoked on all feedback, good and bad. So tell us whats on your mind and we can work towards the best possible camp experience on the planet!

Just don't bag on snowboarders in the park. We have ZERO, and I mean it, patience for that and will pull a Jay and Silent Bob. 

Ski ya later!
Jul 6 2008 8:52PM
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freezed
Posts: 12973 - Karma: 500
word, all the ski campers seem really stoked.
Jul 6 2008 8:58PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
Thank you!   OK bluntly.. I thought that after this thread from last week we would get a camper update, first and foremost.


Honestly, Mosseaus update of the Oakley team was...  I dunno..  Now that it is summer, I feel overwhelmed with epic shots of the pros from the regular season and feel like you guys are pro-hos...    Enough is enough..  IMO of course, who cares what I think?

I think COC could take a lesson from Windells video in this thread, that edit simply awesome and look to me like what the general NS audience wants to see, at least by the comments.

I wish I could create a poll asking the NS members what they would like to see in the updates.  yeeessssss   I am biased,  but hey, am I really that different than anyone else who has friends that are out there and is a member of NS following these updates? 
Jul 6 2008 9:33PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
hate love hate love hate love.. 

Connor I love this edit!  Dude, you got skills.  I feel so bad for tossing shit.  Sorry man!

https://www.newschoolers.com/web/content/videos/id/200081/
Jul 6 2008 11:38PM
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Cronin
Posts: 136 - Karma: 10
it definetly seemed like there was plenty of media be taken of campers while i was out there.... whether it be of the jump line or the coc jam it seemed there were plenty of pics and vid be taken all week long... and that edit is sweet, it shows how rediculously sweet last week was.... i mean it showed from sterbenz teaching me a 360, to shots of actually tatented campers killin it, to the pros and coaches doing what they do best, really shows off coc and session b.... awesome job man
Jul 7 2008 3:20AM
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skodeo7
Posts: 14949 - Karma: 9,234
Papa I think your a bit out of line by calling Scofield "full of himself". At no point in this thread is he anything but completely sincere, explaining the truth of the situation.

That video above is a shining example of what a camp video should look like.
Jul 7 2008 9:49AM
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Trennon
Posts: 75 - Karma: 806
Lots of good comments in this thread, and like Campofchamps said, I think all of the camps out there really like to get feedback, both good and bad. If nobody ever criticized then we would never know what we need to improve on.

I think that we (Momentum) have definitely been a little guilty of focusing on the coaches and pros in our edits, so thanks for calling us out on that, I've got the video guys working on some new stuff now, and I let them know that we want to see lots of campers in the next one!

As for the video at camp, we're in the process of adjusting things. We have always done video and video review every day for every camper, and that worked great when we were a smaller camp. Now that we have expanded, we are realizing that in order to try and get everyone, everyday, we end up with very limited sessions (sometimes only a couple of hits or features per camper). That is what we experienced in session 3.

So, we are trying a new system this week (session 4). Instead of short sessions every day, we are now doing longer sessions on alternating days. This gives the campers more chances to session a feature on video, and hopefully makes for a more productive video review session with their coach. I'm looking for feedback at the end of the session, to see what everyone thinks.

This summer is a big learning experience for us, as we adjust to more terrain, more campers, etc. Overall we are really happy with how everything is going, but we are also learning a lot about how to make everything even better for next summer.
Jul 7 2008 1:27PM
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EClay46
Posts: 2499 - Karma: 69
i think that alternating days will be better, because u just dont get enough video to see any progression or multiple hits to critique against or see what you did right
Jul 7 2008 6:18PM
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