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Guns dont kill people........

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Ski1erman
Posts: 124 - Karma: 10
people kill people..

discus.

my 2 cents is i say we have gun laws but in the end of the day i believe good law abiding people should be able to have and carry a gun.
Mar 25 2008 12:21AM
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Rosbif
Posts: 2543 - Karma: 930
Guns don't kill people.... Rappers Do!


Mar 25 2008 1:39PM
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BeerGoggles
Posts: 712 - Karma: 11
You're right, I probably dont. I understand where people are coming from saying that if guns are banned only criminals will have guns. I also agree and think most people wouldnt be carrying a concealed gun just for shits and can be trusted with one. I've been out to bars in the States more than a few times and have felt just as safe as if I were at home.

It's maybe just the talk about all of it that freaks me out a bit and I'm imagining some paranoid scenario.
Like imagine being in a bar and you tell some obnoxious guy off, but he's hammered and happens to have a gun on him for whatever reason. If a gun got pulled on me for a similar reason, I'd be mighty pissed.

But maybe there's a few too many "maybes" and "what ifs" in this scenario; I'm not sure why it came to mind.
Mar 25 2008 1:46PM
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Norred
Posts: 3520 - Karma: 13
I realize most of you aren't old enough to own a gun, but I'm curious if any of you are, or do.  I was brought up around guns.  Not only for hunting but sport shooting and enjoyment.  I happen to own my fair share of firearms, from an assortment of different caliber hand guns, big bore revolvers, hunting rifles, shotguns and even a couple of assault rifles.  Some of them were handed down through my family, but most of them I've purchased on my own.  I'm also an NRA certified gun safety instructor, and a member of the Maricopa County Sherrif's Posse.  Owning a gun is a huge responsibility.  Two years ago I went through the course required to obtain an Arizona Concealed Carry Permit.  Most of it was class room, but part of it was on the range.  I was astonished by the incompetence of a handful of people in this course, who's goal was to carry a weapon on them for self defense.  One woman attempted to load her magazine backwards, and another "accidentally" discharged several rounds from a small revolver into the ceiling of the indoor range.  About half the class of close to 50 people failed to put 7 out of 10 rounds at 10 yards into a 35x45 paper target under no duress!  In the state of AZ anyone 21 years of age with no prior felony convictions and no history of mental illness can walk into a gun shop and walk out 15 minutes later with a gun.  Regardless of whether or not they have ever even held one in their hands.  Something does need to be done to educate those who chose to excercise their right to own a firearm, but never should that right be taken from us.
    Everyone knows the security issues with our borders, and anyone who lives in the Southwestern US deals with it on a daily basis.  I work hard to afford my home in a decent neighborhood, but the area I work in is certainly less than desireable.  The violence in the Mexican border towns caused by drug and human smuggling operations is spilling over into US cities.  It's the first thing I see every night on the news.  Every day there's another "drop" house busted, or another shooting.  The Democrats want to take the guns away from responsible gun owners like myself which will solve nothing.  I sleep peacefully at night knowing that when the time comes and some crack fueled intruder decides to chose my place to rob, I'll have the necessary "tools" to defend myself, my girlfriend, and my belongings until law enforcement arrives.  By disarming the law abiding citizens, all you accomplish is to allow the criminals to operate with impunity. 
Mar 25 2008 1:48PM
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grubix2
Posts: 2628 - Karma: 25
The biggest problem I have is with handguns.  They are completely unnecessary.  Shot guns and rifles... very practical.  Primarily for hunting and sport shooting, and yes you could use it for self defense if need be.  I personally don't want handguns to be readily available to everyone.  They're compact and concealable.  You can carry them anywhere.  Even compact 9mm can hold up to a 12 round magazine.  Good luck sneaking around with a shotgun, even if it is sawed off.

I live in a city.  I see crime on a first hand basis all the time.  Carrying a gun on me would not make me feel any safe.  As coincidence would have it.  My friend's apartment was just robbed at gunpoint last wekk.  My friend and his room mate were just waking up to go to class at 8 AM and this white dude in a uniform that looked like the gas man, knocked on the door, and said he needed to come in and make sure the stove and furnace was off in the house before they worked on the gas line.  Well as soon as he opened the door, the guy pulled a gun on them, and told them to sit down on the couch together.  He took both of their cell phones and broke them, and pulled all the phone lines out of the apartment.  then these two black dudes came in and started carrying out all their shit into this truck.  48 in Plasma screen, computers, Xbox 360.  Even their text books.  Well after they cleared the apartment, they simply hopped back in the truck and left.  My friend keeps a loaded Glock 17 under his bed.  He didn't have a chance in hell of using it though.

I really hate when people say they need to have guns for self defense.  The only way it will save your ass is if you sleep with the damn thing under your pillow or tucked in your boxers.  If someone is robbing you, they pull the gun on you so fast, so don't even have time to breath let alone pull it out of the holster and take the safety off.  And any of you guys living in a nice suburban neighborhood... i dont even want to hear it.  You're little brother is more likely to find the gun and shoot himself playing with it, than will you have any chance in using it on someone breaking into your house.
Mar 25 2008 2:12PM
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KeithB.
Posts: 608 - Karma: 12
OK, First, Shooting is a sport, just like hunting, or skiing. There is actually a thing called a biathalon in which you nordic ski and at intervals you shoot at targets. Hand guns are fun to shoot and I don't like anyone telling me I can't participate in a sport I enjoy. Secondly, with a concealed weapons permit you may not bring your firearm into any place that serves alchohol, any goverment building, any place that has sinage posted regarding gun free zone, and you may not be drunk and carrying. If you are someone who cares to obtain a concealed weapons permit chances are you will abide by the rules that go along with it. Many of the nice folks who have said permits get them for reasons of transportation. For instance, in NH your gun has to be in plain sight in your vehicle, but in colorado it needs to be in a locked case. Now if you have your firearm in a backpack it is considered concealed and not allowed without the permit.
Mar 25 2008 2:18PM
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coolhandluke
Posts: 4465 - Karma: 153
would you be surprised to learn that the FBI does not teach scenarios where the BG draws a handgun from a concealed carry holster? 
Mar 25 2008 2:39PM
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slaydave
Posts: 1697 - Karma: 62

dude speaks the truth...

Mar 25 2008 2:53PM
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graciousstallion
Posts: 363 - Karma: 13
thank you.
Mar 25 2008 3:02PM
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wev-skis
Posts: 564 - Karma: 10
thats a really good point.  nicely said.
Mar 25 2008 3:13PM
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KeithB.
Posts: 608 - Karma: 12
You are ignorant. Thats alright though, I forgive you.
Mar 25 2008 3:22PM
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slaydave
Posts: 1697 - Karma: 62

how is that ignorant?? its a shame we cant realize the solution really is that simple... thou shall not kill....

youd think humans wouldnt be so.... well... ignorant...

Mar 25 2008 3:26PM
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Skiingslikewhoa
Posts: 426 - Karma: 12
I remember doing some shit in like grade 9 haveing to do with gun laws. I don't know how true this was cause I was just stats off Google and wikipedia but we found out that there were way more stabbing and violent death tolls and crime rates in Canada per a capita then in the US.

Also heres another tidbit to think about, in Isreal you cant have more then a group of 6 people travel publicly without one of them being regisered and highly trained and carrying a sub-automatic gun. They dont have any problems with people carrying these guns cause they're trained and they now their shit.
Mar 25 2008 3:47PM
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skiminnesota
Posts: 9093 - Karma: 429
i will chalk this up to mindless ignorance...




lets say your family is being held at gun point and you have the chance to shoot the person executing the crime, would you?  
you can bet your ass i would, if you play with fire(people) your going to bet burned..
Mar 25 2008 3:56PM
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SharfSchutze
Posts: 130 - Karma: 10
Criminals prefer unarmed victims.
Mar 25 2008 4:00PM
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KeithB.
Posts: 608 - Karma: 12
If you have been reading all the posts you might remember reading one where I mentioned that shooting is a sport.
Mar 25 2008 4:35PM
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John.
Posts: 1327 - Karma: 11
In a perfect world no guns exist, maybe. But today, where there are way too many fucked up individuals then there are lots of reasons why you would need a gun.
Mar 25 2008 4:41PM
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KeithB.
Posts: 608 - Karma: 12
Guns don't kill people, heart disease, cancer of all kinds, and automobiles are your major killers of people. All of you who are complaining about guns are doing so because that is what you have been conditioned to fear. Nobody thinks twice about going for a car ride or eating a cheeseburger, but in reality it is the things we do every day that will kill us. Eventhough we may ski beyond the ability of 99% of people and put ourselves at risk doing so, it is heart disease, cancer, and driving that will be the end of most of us. Should we have mandatory restrictions on the foods we eat (in relation to fat content, obviously there are quality standards, so don't go there)? Should we ban automobiles and force people to ride trains and buses? Shit why don't we let the government tell us who we should marry and what style of clothes we should wear and who we can call on the phone and what books we should read...get my point?
Mar 25 2008 4:57PM
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Alexander_Keith
Posts: 3204 - Karma: 25
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1119965250902_5/?hub=
Mar 25 2008 6:04PM
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coolhandluke
Posts: 4465 - Karma: 153
either you are 8'0" 500lbs or live in a bubble.....crime is everywhere

here's a fun virtual field trip for everyone: 
how much crime is there near the White House?  go to: http://crimemap.dc.gov/presentation/query.asp
enter in 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW for the address, and enjoy

according to the Metropolitan Police Department's website, Washington DC averages about 8,000 violent crimes and 26,000 property crimes per year........all in a 60 square mile block of politicians.

so next time you vote remember you are sending your poor local politician into a place he/she shouldn't be.
Mar 25 2008 6:08PM
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skogenjake
Posts: 6685 - Karma: 511
yeah because they took out every gun range in america now. dons guns on 38th...that now is a bakery.

no. just no.

people enjoy shooting for fun or sport. like archery. you try to hit the little target. fact
Mar 25 2008 6:22PM
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powderdrunkie
Posts: 2034 - Karma: 976
i hate it when people don't know their no's. or their there's. what the fuck is wrong with everyone, no wonder you're all shooting each other.

i'll have a gun when you try to kill me though
Mar 25 2008 6:33PM
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skogenjake
Posts: 6685 - Karma: 511
wow just read everything Quinny said on the previous page. that is a spot on arguement.

and yes, if they are illegal, they will still exist based on the guns already out there and how easy it is to get them. is weed illegal? yes. does half the kids on my floor have a piece and some trees in their sock drawer? yes. it wouldnt stop anything. if someone is going to murder someone with a gun, do you think a gun ban would have any effect? if you are a criminal and determined, then yes, im sure everyone planning a crime would get together and make the conscious decision to admit defeat and try crossbows.

those that own guns keep them locked up and are generally safe with them when it comes to the surburban population of dads you are addressing. it isnt harold and kumar. yes canada, you are far more intelligent than all of us hicks down here, but no, we still realize that a gun isnt meant to by left out for kids to play with. unless you are in fact a criminal...its a cycle.

350 a day?

well i doubt it but if its true maybe its because we have more people. and major cities.
Mar 25 2008 6:33PM
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Ben.
Posts: 21463 - Karma: 683
well said. we dont need em theres no reason to have em.
Mar 25 2008 7:22PM
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PhaedeD
Posts: 11498 - Karma: 327
^ obviously no one has ever tried to car jack this kid. its nice having on in your cent console when someone comes up trying to steal your car. ya getting car jacked doesnt happen very often but when you roll around jap cars with thousands of dollars worth of parts on it you would be surprised what people will do to have the shit. i have been in this situation.
Mar 25 2008 7:26PM
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powderdrunkie
Posts: 2034 - Karma: 976
too bad i'd steal your car with my mind
Mar 25 2008 7:33PM
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PhaedeD
Posts: 11498 - Karma: 327
to bad i would rape you then call no homo.
Mar 25 2008 7:36PM
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Sufferboy
Posts: 4241 - Karma: 122

ur dumb, my friend was cleaning his gun and it went of and now hes dead

the gun killed him not ppl

Mar 25 2008 7:37PM
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powderdrunkie
Posts: 2034 - Karma: 976
Mmm
Mar 25 2008 7:41PM
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SharfSchutze
Posts: 130 - Karma: 10
The areas where handguns are banned having rising crime, whereas places with CCW laws being implemented are seeing them fall. Criminals fear law-abiding citizens owning guns.
Mar 25 2008 7:44PM
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Black-Bandanna
Posts: 6680 - Karma: 1,603
HAHA!!!!! ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME!?

That is THE MOST dimwitted statement I have EVER heard on this website in 3 years. Wow. Somebody give this man the Golden Wheelchair award. WOW.
Mar 25 2008 7:47PM
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Sufferboy
Posts: 4241 - Karma: 122
dude don't be so harsh, they are ment to kill people or harm them in some way, thats what they were made for was easy killing
Mar 25 2008 7:48PM
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freeridinskier
Posts: 748 - Karma: 10
so, i have learned a few things on this thread:

1-Handguns are only meant to kill people, (but shotguns and rifles are ok and hunting is ok, you just have to carry a long gun around with you when you are bowhunting to defend yourself from bears or other large animals, since handguns are only for killing other people)

2-If you are robbed in your own house, guns are totally unnecesary since you wont get to them in time in less, I think this is right, if they are tucked in your boxers when you sleep. You should also just let the criminal take everything, just sit back and watch, maybe the criminal will even kidnapp a loved one or a child as you watch defensless.

3-If i move to canada I will not have to worry about being robbed or victimized since canada has much stricter gun laws.

4-The second amendment is no longer valid (so I guess maybe we should start looking at other parts of the constitution and re assesing everything)

5-The comments on this thread are exactly as I expected on a website containing mostly teenage, idealist, emotional (not rational,) thinking skiers.

just another thought, you all better bet your ass there will be a damn civil war if the government comes knocking on doors rounding up handguns, assault rifles, etc. And to everyone that thinks the gun owning american has no chance in hell against the american government, if it were to get out of hand is forgetting one major thing. most people in the military are not going to carry out orders from a oppressive government taking away gun rights or whatever else their agenda might be.  The military in general will be on the side of responsible gun owners. We have already witnessed what will happen when the government comes and rounds up the people's guns. Gun registeration was the first thing Hitler did, so he could go round up the firearms and then do whatever he wanted to the people of germany. 
Mar 25 2008 7:51PM
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KeithB.
Posts: 608 - Karma: 12
Sorry about your friend, but a gun is not able to fire without some external force applied. Your friend should have checked to make sure it was unloaded. His lack of respect for his firearm resulted in an unfortunate situation in which he killed himself. Why would you squeeze the trigger while cleaning the barrel? In fact, this scenario sounds suspect, sorry if I am wrong, but it does not sound likely.
Mar 25 2008 7:52PM
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Sufferboy
Posts: 4241 - Karma: 122
he didn't squeeze the trigger

i guess he droped it and forgot to take the bullet out and the force shot him some how
Mar 25 2008 7:53PM
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Black-Bandanna
Posts: 6680 - Karma: 1,603
I just can't fucking stand the ignorance. I hate people taking on a subject that they don't understand. I have multiple hand guns and I did NOT have the intent to kill another human being when I bought them. They're used for protection while hunting against bear and other large predators. In some states, it's illegal to hunt without a sidearm because of the danger. I cannot stand it when people make statements like that. I'm sorry if it seemed harsh, but that's how i feel.
Mar 25 2008 7:54PM
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powderdrunkie
Posts: 2034 - Karma: 976

hey good job falling into your own category

Mar 25 2008 7:55PM
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freeridinskier
Posts: 748 - Karma: 10
sorry to hear about your friend, but that's his own ignorance
Mar 25 2008 7:55PM
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Black-Bandanna
Posts: 6680 - Karma: 1,603
And yes I know they were created for "easy killing, " but that is NOT the sole or major reason for what they are used for.
Mar 25 2008 7:56PM
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Sufferboy
Posts: 4241 - Karma: 122
do u have the iintention now?

jk

i know they can be used for that but, in the west they were made to kill robbers and indian, no lie
Mar 25 2008 7:56PM
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freeridinskier
Posts: 748 - Karma: 10
umm that doesnt even make sense, first off I am not a teenager, secondly I am not at emotional thinker or an idealist, oh well I guess I am a skier, so I must fall into the category. you really know me well. 
Mar 25 2008 7:58PM
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Skierguy1234
Posts: 1684 - Karma: 88
i was all for gun laws, until my english teacher told me something the other day...
"95% of gun related crimes are commmited with stolen or unregistered weapons."
theres really no laws you can make to fix that.
Mar 25 2008 7:59PM
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Sufferboy
Posts: 4241 - Karma: 122
In Detroit it is,

im not mad about that it just Pisses me off how everyone is assholes to everyone else on NS when ever they get the chance
Mar 25 2008 8:01PM
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powderdrunkie
Posts: 2034 - Karma: 976

yeah maybe other people aren't either stop generalizing

Mar 25 2008 8:03PM
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PilleDaKid
Posts: 3193 - Karma: 2,629
Word NO HOMO.
Mar 25 2008 8:10PM
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Ben.
Posts: 21463 - Karma: 683
i just dont get people. so stuck up about their right to have fun with a pointless handgun that millions will continue to die
Mar 25 2008 8:12PM
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KeithB.
Posts: 608 - Karma: 12
No. Unless you pull the trigger the gun will not fire. This is a common misconception. The firing pin does not rest against the cap, it strkes when you pull the trigger.
Mar 25 2008 8:13PM
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Sufferboy
Posts: 4241 - Karma: 122
thats crazy
Mar 25 2008 8:14PM
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powderdrunkie
Posts: 2034 - Karma: 976

most people don't have hand guns for "fun"

unless protecting yourself is a from someone with a gun is enjoyable

Mar 25 2008 8:14PM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,686
there are billion people in the world today
we can not feed them all
1000 years ago there was less then a few million.

why is it that we value human life so much more now then we did then?

Let the bodies hit the floor.
Mar 25 2008 8:36PM
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TheButterHashira
Posts: 9691 - Karma: 1,702
Both of my grandmas carry hand guns. So far they haven't killed anyone with them. My grandma in louisiana is just crazy, but the other one owns a big ass trailer park and has to collect rent from drunk welfare check recieving people.
Nothing in that statement was an exaggeration, just proves that the south is pretty fucking crazy.
If people bought handguns just to kill people wouldn't there be a hell of a lot more murders in this country? People buy handguns every day but most people carry them for protection, or just for the hell of having a gun(collectors?).
Mar 25 2008 8:42PM
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