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Ski engineering?

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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
what areas of engineering would apply for the ski industry? right now im thinkin about going into mechanical, but im still not sure. any ideas?
Dec 16 2007 6:18PM
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wiener
Posts: 2247 - Karma: 63
you can do what i am doing and go into materials eng. that way you can help in the making of skis
Dec 16 2007 6:27PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
They all "apply"  but civil and Material Science is probably the best.

We have an enterprise group that makes their own skis and boards at my school.  They build boxes and rails too. 
Dec 16 2007 6:32PM
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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
civil engineering would apply?
Dec 16 2007 6:37PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
you ever see the foundations they put on chair lifts?  The whole structural system of a chair lift is awesome.  There is a bunch to consider from what kind of soil you have to how big you foundation is, the moment you are going to get on the pole.  All connections when putting up the poles.  Think about the massive structural system in gondolas. 

They just put a new lift in at my hill and I was out there talking to a lot of the civil engineers about the design and the process.  (since I am studying Civil as well)  The Mechanical only delt with the motor running it and the motor isn't powerful enough...woops

Another thing although not directly related to the ski industry is public works/city engineers.  Many civils are hired by cities and counties and it allows you to be around the mountains and ski. 
Dec 16 2007 6:47PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
Although I know what you are trying to get at I don't exactly agree. 

We deal with basically 5 materials, Soil, asphalt concrete, Portland cement concrete, Reinforced concrete, and steel (also timber and masonry...but not really as much).  None of which really goes with skiing.  The big thing with civil is the structure is not moving it is static.  A ski is dynamic, always in motion.  When I analyze a load on a beam I look at instant deflection and 5 year deflections (and others too...).  The load just sits and sits though. 

With a civil background I would find it hard to understand what is happening in a ski and how it flexes.  I mean I just finished the preliminary design on a 5 story reinforced concrete building....not exactly a ski.  I know if I was designing a ski I would not be calling a civil.  I would be calling a material because although materials is chem based they understand how a material behaves.  They will be able to determine the flex and stiffness and adhesives need, etc...
Dec 16 2007 6:58PM
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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
it seems like not many schools provide materials engineering courses though...
Dec 16 2007 7:04PM
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dan.b
Posts: 866 - Karma: 10
polytechnique have this program but there's like less then 2-3 persons in this degree (per year). looking for some mechanical engineering with specialisation in material could be an option for you.
Dec 16 2007 7:16PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
Two good schools I can think of off the top of my head.

1) Colorado School of Mines.  really good school and it is right near all the mountains out there. 

2) Michigan Technological University.  Also a really good school.  There material course has 100% job placement out of college, so end all be all you can find a job after school.  Plus they have the enterprise program that makes board and skis and boxes and stuff. Michigan Tech owns its own ski hill, even though it is only Mont Ripley (500' vertical).  It is a nice little hill that is about a 1 min drive from campus.  Also Mt Bohemia is right there 45 min away and it has sick terrain.  The area also gets the most snow in the world for a non-mountainness region.  We get about 300-350" a year.  I have rode pow more days so far this year then groomers.  I rode pow today for example.  We build a decent park a Ripley and it keeps improving.  If you haven't figured it out I go to school here.  The materials department is very cool here too. 
Dec 16 2007 7:18PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
good call.

I was just making sure you didn't think we dealt with ski physics...Although I am going to have to start convincing people it should be a civil class.  It would be sweet.

And true on the problem solving too.  I was doing mechanical work half the time at my internship this summer and it was knowing how to go about stuff that helped.

So ya good call.
Dec 16 2007 7:21PM
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Getpoolside
Posts: 83 - Karma: 69
What school do you go to? i'm building skis for my senior project and need to find people who have done it already.
Dec 16 2007 7:28PM
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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
haha too bad i haven't taken my SAT's and i live in canada.
Dec 16 2007 7:51PM
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sbark
Posts: 300 - Karma: 11
ask the companies, and do you want to design ski hill equipment or skis themselves. go to  a good engineering school, since you are in Canada, waterloo, UNB, are good, there are also design engineering sources out there, normally there is one year general then in the second year you specialize into a field.
Dec 16 2007 8:09PM
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sim
Posts: 1399 - Karma: -6
Not exactly to do with making skis, but civil also deals with avalanches.  The UofC has grad level courses on avalanches and the mechanics behind them etc.

Not to start any too huge of a debate, but you definetly don't need to go to the states for engg.  Canadian universities probably do a better job teaching it.  Its reflected in the FE exam that any American wanting to work as an EIT has to write and any Canadian/International wishing to do work in the states or for an American company.  Anyway, Canadians tend to score much higher.
Dec 16 2007 9:12PM
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Inbred_Redneck
Posts: 2776 - Karma: 28
Anyone know of any good colleges that have these courses in the US?
Dec 16 2007 9:37PM
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mcsean
Posts: 844 - Karma: 20
Materials engineering is usually part of the Mechanical Engineering faculty... The materials kids just take a few specific materials courses that us regular Mechanical students don't have to take (but we still can if we really wanted..).

I'm actually in the exact same boat as you, though I came to the realization a little late (I'm already halfway done my 3rd year of mechanical engineering). I really really want a job within the ski industry, rather than working in some random manufacturing plant pumping out products I couldn't give a fuck about.

Working for a lift maker/installer is cool and all, but there's really only 3 or 4 main producers of lifts, who each employ probably less than 20 engineers. When you think about it, that is one EXTREMELY small job market.

I'm sure Marker hired a few mechanical engineers to design the Duke and Jester bindings.. but can't see that being a permanent job as it was most likely a year contract or something until the design and testing processes were complete.

If you really want a job in the ski industry, going into engineering may not be your best bet.
Dec 16 2007 10:10PM
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mcsean
Posts: 844 - Karma: 20
With that said though... mechanical engineers make some serious dough - $50K+ your first year out of school if you went to a decent university. With all that cash you could go heliskiing once a year  (or more if you wanted) and get to ski every weekend, since we usually get weekday 9am-5pm type jobs.

The school suggestions I've read in this thread are totally whack, so make sure you do your own research. Seriously, UNB for engineering? ahhahaha!! Waterloo looks good on paper to comapnies like Microsoft and RIM, but if you want to get into the ski industry they are most likely not looking for uber-nerdy asian kids.

Suggestions:

univerty of toronto
Mcgill
Queens (gotta give a plug to my own school)
mcmaster
ecole polytechnique
Dec 16 2007 10:21PM
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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
ya im thinking mcgill right now. they don't have materials though. would mechanical or chemical engineering be closer to materials?
Dec 16 2007 10:31PM
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mcsean
Posts: 844 - Karma: 20
like I said, Materials engineering is just a specialized branch of mechanical engineering. Chemical engineering is like your high-school chemistry, it's more chemical processes rather than material properties. Like, for example, the way an oil refinery works would be pretty big in chem eng.

I find it hard to believe Mcgill doesnt have materials/metallurgical courses... I'd check with the mechanical engineering faculty before assuming they just don't offer materials engineering.
Dec 16 2007 10:39PM
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Microcosm
Posts: 4765 - Karma: 153
does UVM have an engineering program?
Dec 16 2007 10:44PM
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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
my bad i haven't actually checked mcgill yet for materials. i was planning on applying tomorrow night.

McGill has Mining, Metals and Materials Engineering as a faculty, and mining engineering as well as materials engineering as the departments 2 undergraduate programs.

another question... say i took materials engineering at mcgill, and i was not able to get a job in the ski industry, would my degree be almost useless, or is there a high demand and a variety of careers i could take having that degree?
Dec 16 2007 10:58PM
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Skiing_Is_Fun
Posts: 1463 - Karma: 91
You will get a good job with any type of engineering degree. Go into Aerospace. Thats what I'm doing here at CU because I'm pretty sure that is going to be one of the most rewarding types of engineering in the future. Just think, space is the final frontier and people want to go there. Right now, NASA and other government agencies control space. If you start a private company that can fly to the moon, or just take people into space for fun, you might be the next bill gates^10. haha
Dec 16 2007 11:12PM
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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
bed time bump
Dec 16 2007 11:12PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
At my school, like I said, The Materials people have 100% job placement .  You basically can work for any company in the world because everything they make is a material.  Demand is pretty much great for them.

Also check out Mcgills Materials department, call them up talk to them etc.  Get a feel for what they are and what it will be like. 



Also since when did ME = Materials?? That one is throwing me for a loop.
Dec 16 2007 11:34PM
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Skiing_Is_Fun
Posts: 1463 - Karma: 91
ME=Materials engineering
Dec 16 2007 11:38PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
lol....

ME is Mechanical engineering...but you are a clever one indeed
Dec 16 2007 11:40PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
Also it is typically MSE = Material Science Engineering...
Dec 16 2007 11:40PM
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Skiing_Is_Fun
Posts: 1463 - Karma: 91
oh, i see
Dec 16 2007 11:41PM
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spwrozek
Posts: 184 - Karma: 10
ya no bigs

I mainly asked because I was going to go into MSE and all the schools I looked at ME and MSE were completely unrelated and had different buildings and everything.  So I was just confused.
Dec 16 2007 11:45PM
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mittfree
Posts: 329 - Karma: 15
If I can just make one reccomendation to the OP, use your first year to learn more about the different fields offered at whatever school you get into. What you specialize in can depend a lot on what your strengths are, for example physics is more civil/mechanical related, chemistry is obviously chemcial/materials related, biology is more biomedical related. I would also say that you shouldn't limit yourself to trying to get in the ski industry, just because its relatively small. For example I'm a Mat E specializing in ceramics, but I have an upcoming 8 month work experience term in Vancouver. I'm not going to be doing any work related to skiing, but I'll still be able to be up in Whistler every weekend. If you're determined to go the materials route, I wouldn't worry about a job, right now they're most in demand out of any engineering degree.
Dec 17 2007 2:34AM
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devo97
Posts: 53 - Karma: 10
obviusly you know nothing about the engineering program at UNB fredericton. It is the oldest and one of the best engineering programs in Canada so why don't you do some research!
Dec 17 2007 2:25PM
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coolhandluke
Posts: 4465 - Karma: 153
there are a variety of options.......

the easiest way into the industry straight outta college might be as a CAD tech.  skis, bindings, chairlifts........all those come from companies who have a $15/hour guy doing all the boring 3D drafting

obviously ski companies need some materials engineers and lift companies need mechanical engineers, but i bet those jobs are few and far between

my personal bias as a young budding civil engineer is that resort development is the biggest skiing-related engineering field.  resorts are always expanding and any civil (or civil intern) knows that before any dirt gets pushed around there are years worth of permitting and design work. 

there's also geotech.  think of how many lift towers you've seen in a crazy place.

even if you did construction management and got a job with Kiewit and got assigned to BC's Highway 99 improvements you could be doing "engineering" on the weekdays and slaying Whistler on the weekends.








Dec 17 2007 3:08PM
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sbark
Posts: 300 - Karma: 11
Like he said, UNB is the oldest University in Canada. There engineering program is in the top 10 every year. My brother goes there for electrical and he is trying to convince me to go there. however you may be right about waterloo. However it is rated 1-3 in Canada for a long time. For better information you would have to talk to companies and universities, sorry I cant help more.

Try getting an internship if you can. that may help you figure out what you need.
Dec 17 2007 3:30PM
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[nick]
Posts: 1043 - Karma: 423
I'm majoring in plastics engineering, think about it:

Bindings
Goggle frames
Pole grips and Baskets
Helmets
Boots

The possibilities are endless
Dec 17 2007 3:50PM
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mel220
Posts: 31 - Karma: 20
ya same im building skis for my science research project, anyone have any tips or know anyone who already has a ski press made?
Dec 17 2007 3:58PM
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dan.b
Posts: 866 - Karma: 10
dont know if its still online but there was a website for people making ski. try google you should find it.  There some info on skipass.com if you can read french.
Dec 17 2007 4:09PM
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coolhandluke
Posts: 4465 - Karma: 153
i think injection modeling machines pretty much run that ship
Dec 17 2007 4:11PM
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dan.b
Posts: 866 - Karma: 10
www.skibuilders.com

Dec 17 2007 4:13PM
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dan.b
Posts: 866 - Karma: 10
and civil engineering might not have a lot of application in the ski industry (beside foundation of chairlift...) but you have a lot of free time during winter so you have a lot of time to ski...
Dec 17 2007 4:15PM
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coolhandluke
Posts: 4465 - Karma: 153
really?  there's a whole bunch more infrastructure involved at a ski resort than foundation design

i just think there's a lot more resorts expanding their facilities than ski companies cooking up a new plastic

the winter downtime only applies to construction firms...there's not a terrible amount of free time in the winter for engineers...its frantic design season so everything can get thru the review processes in time to get out to bid come springtime. 
Dec 17 2007 4:30PM
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[nick]
Posts: 1043 - Karma: 423
by the time i graduate i will be an expert in the injection molding and design process
Dec 17 2007 5:06PM
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mcsean
Posts: 844 - Karma: 20
Show me a single article (not written by UNB) that praises their engineering program as much as you do. I honestly tried to do my research but can't find a damn thing about how great their engineering programs are.

old=good? uhhh no.
Dec 17 2007 6:20PM
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sbark
Posts: 300 - Karma: 11
Engineering is concidered a comprehensive course by many, try this link:
http://www.macleans.ca/education/universities/acomprehensive.pdf

and there are not many articles on UNB because it is small, does not attract students, and many papers are written on fanous students or programs at a university, take UofA for example: they are known for their nanotech,  because it is unique, and it is a large university that attracts a lot of attention.
Dec 17 2007 6:43PM
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rather.be.skiing
Posts: 239 - Karma: 15
what program are you in? that would be such a sick project.
Dec 17 2007 7:40PM
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devo97
Posts: 53 - Karma: 10
I know this article is written by UNB but before you say it means nothingI would like to point out that they aren't claiming how great their program is this is based on an outsided opinion looking at engineering inovations from around the world.

http://www.unb.ca/news/view.cgi?id=1420
Dec 17 2007 8:38PM
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mcsean
Posts: 844 - Karma: 20
I don't have a problem admitting that's pretty cool! +1 for UNB. Pretty cool stuff for such a small school.




...that Macleans comprehensive list is really weak though. As are Macleans rankings in general, that's why most schools refuse to give Macleans info nowadays.
Dec 17 2007 9:59PM
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steve0
Posts: 1130 - Karma: 1,308
I'm a mechanical engineer at clarkson university and i just finished my sr design project where we built a ski press and turned out a ski. The ski was alot better than we had expected, but it was definately a prototype and we've got a ways to go. I'm doing an independant study class next semester where i'm jsut gonn build skis with the schools money so that's pretty sick, but yeah mechanical engineering is definately a good way to go.
Dec 17 2007 10:35PM
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