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I will hang for saying this, but....

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SkiMN
Posts: 4005 - Karma: 38
We need to raise the driving age to 18. Start the permit program at 14 like most states do now, but I don't know any people who are ready to drive at 16. To keep the following rant in perspective, I'm 17 years old. I have not been caught speeding once cause I'm to pussy to do more than 8 or 9 over. I did hit a mailbox once, and I've almost fucked up badly twice. I do not exclude myself from the following rant.

I hit a mailbox and almost t-boned a Ford at an intersection I use every day. I have a fried who drives a blazer that he thinks is roll proof. (he will probably read this, good, cause I'm not gonna help tip it back over) I know a kid who rolled twice in the same spot, on two separate days. I can go on and on.

You get behind the wheel alone for the first time and it feels great. We've all been there. Nothing can stop you, and its all totally safe. You'll never crash, get pulled over, die, all you know is that you have freedom on a whole new level. Great. Now wait until you have that close call, then reality sets in. To overuse an ol drivers ed line, your sitting on a time bomb.

I thought I was a great driver. I've had a few little reminders lately that I'm not. The only, and I do mean only thing that makes you a good safe driver is experience. Exposure to driving (ie permit driving) and some common sense that comes as you pass through the raging hormones that are your teen years, can help you get that experience and live to tell about it.

For way to many teens, it takes a close call, or a tragedy, to really drive home what I'm talking about here. Most people simply aren't mature enough for the responsibility involved in driving. You can do more than hurt yourself, but other people too.

Driving is your first test. You really have to be an adult to pull it off, but theres a problem. At 16, you're anything but. If you're like most of my friends your just a walking boner with a lead foot, and I've heard way to many girls actually say "Do I really have to stop at stop signs?". Not gonna saw which sex is better behind the wheel, but ego has a lot to do with it.

Aight after some random, unorganized thoughts I'm gonna sit back and hopefully some intelligent discussion will materialize so I can keep going with this. I'd like a CIVILIZED discussion of the topic and those who are still waiting for that first set of keys are also welcome to voice their opinions.
Oct 23 2007 11:27PM
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user098123
Posts: 6072 - Karma: 18
TLDR, but I agree with the beginning, kinda.

When I was 16, I felt very mature, confident, so on and so forth. Very capable of driving. 6 months later I totalled my car, since then, I've had some tickets, nothing major though.

My brother is turning 16 in december, and I never realized how young 16 actually is. There is no way I can ever envision him or his friends alone, behind the wheel of a car, maybe they are just more immature than other kids their age, I don't know. Regardless, it scares me. 17 at least would probably be better, I think you grow up really fast during those teenage years, and just 1 more year would help out considerably.
Oct 23 2007 11:39PM
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dman1260
Posts: 899 - Karma: 13
since i'm over 18, i say amen to that.
Oct 23 2007 11:40PM
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alaskakid
Posts: 5540 - Karma: 430
This is pretty true...
Oct 23 2007 11:42PM
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snwbrdmilf
Posts: 22441 - Karma: 2,805
"The only, and I do mean only thing that makes you a good safe driver is experience."

That is very true. You have to have a respect for driving. It's not a PRIVILEGE to be fucked with.
Oct 23 2007 11:45PM
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eheath
Posts: 61588 - Karma: 122,918
I got my license when I was 15 (montana) and i had no problems for like 3 months, then i got in two fender benders, one minor one and one major one that kept me from driving until 2 months after it happened. And then i has another fender bender that ended up just messing up my fender. Since that I have had no driving problems, its been like 3 years now. It's all about experience.
Oct 23 2007 11:46PM
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Nicholas.
Posts: 10905 - Karma: 60
maybe, but i know that i was fairly cautious (never more than 5-10 over) when i first got mine but after a month or so i managed to slide my moms nice SUV into a ditch. no damage done except to my ego but i am deffinetly even more careful now especially on dirt roads. I wont say that i felt invincible when i first started driving but i for sure had a false sense of security, i thought to myself a few days before when my friend went off a dirt road while i was in the car "thats never gonna happen to me, i drive way to careful" all it took was one press of the gas pedal going around a turn to set me straight, im still nervous driving though, even a few months later.
Oct 23 2007 11:46PM
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Hedwig595
Posts: 76 - Karma: 6
Ok, first, I'm agains the raising the driving age thing I like it where it is.  If it was raised, we would still have the same number of accidents, simply at older ages, and perhaps driving underage would become like drinking underage, everyone does it right?  Well ok not everyone, but a fair majority do.   I also think that a permit program that lasted four years would be very very educational, and definitley cut down on accidents, but that costs a lot of money, also no one is going to want to be able to drive with their parents , then have to do it for four years.  Driving when your young is about freedom, and for many parents it is a load off of their shoulders when kids can drive themselves to school, work or a game.  I'm not saying the age is right or wrong, I just think its a good age. 

NYS has a new law where you can get your permit when your sixteen then you can take a five hour and pass your drivers test you get your limited license where you can drive during the day, but if you take a drivers ed course, they reduce the money on your insurance and you can take your road test to get your full license. 

I've had one ticket, doing 52 in a 35 at 2 am coming home from my friends house.  I was simply tired and so were my friends who were with me and we were rockin to some music, I didn't realize how fast i was going up a hill, and bam got caught.  I got a cell phone ticket too, which was completely my fault and was stupid but I was trying to get my ex back and well I'm glad I tried to get her back even if the cop pulled me over in her driveway, and she didn't come back. Ahhh well!  And the night I got the speeding ticket I backed into my grandmas car which was hidden below the rear window, it was a devastating night.

I've had my fair share of tickets I guess but looking at it, if I had been older, same circumstances just 2 years older (I was 17 so 19) I really don't think it would have made a difference.

Theres a point you get to when your in your car driving your closest friends when you think, wow if I mess up I could kill these guys, and then you take it seriously.  That happens when it happens, theres no age.  Something triggers it and you realize how important life is and you don't take driving as a joke, can't put an age on that.
Oct 23 2007 11:46PM
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Hedwig595
Posts: 76 - Karma: 6
ps: I was so nervous when I started driving omg it scared me. lol
Oct 23 2007 11:48PM
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jimmychung
Posts: 6857 - Karma: 25
i've been thinking this for years, even when i was 16 and excited for my license. not only are nearly all 16 year old unable to drive safely because they are simply not ready or mature enough yet, but no 16 year olds actually NEED to drive. most 16 years olds don't have jobs yet, and if they do it's not all that intense that they can't get their parents to drive them to their few and far between shifts. 16 year olds simply don't need to drive, end of story. 18 years needs to be the new age.
Oct 23 2007 11:48PM
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SkiMN
Posts: 4005 - Karma: 38
On that first part, I too thought I was a great driver. In the whole scheme of things I'm better than a lot of people, but not as good as i thought.

And on age, 16 might as well be 14, but 17 and 18 are totally different.
Oct 23 2007 11:49PM
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thedutchmayn
Posts: 1653 - Karma: 45
man i couldnt agree more. i thought i was a good driver in the beginning and then realized that i really wasn't.  i really second guessed myself a lot and thought about driving once i thought about it started thinking.  my cousin died at 15 in a car accident so that really made me think about driving. other kids dont have things like that to think about though.  nobody thinks about the # of teen deaths per year.  its just a statistic until you know someone that died because someone was being careless behind the wheel. just like you said driving is something fun and you get a feeling of freedom when at the wheel, it is easy to get caught up in that shit. but really your life is in your hands, a bad mistake and its over. i realized i wasnt ready and slowed down the liscense process. im not even driving yet, but i couldve been a year ago, i knew i wasnt ready though.  not to say i havent been fucking retardedly slow and i should have my lisence by now regardless. but...its too irresponsible to take others lives in your own hands.  unfortunately not many people consider this. 

today i was in a car with a friend and we came around a corner and some kid was going wayyyy too fast and swerved/skidded uncontrolably into our lane.  we were far enough away to be safe but still..."what the fuck?"  driving fast really doesnt even save any time. the only way driving fast could make a difference is if the roads are extremely open.  the lights are designed to give people green lights if they go at the right speed. otherwise driving fast gets you into traffic, red lights, and you'll probably be a dick tailgating someone.  slow down, chill.  driving a few mph over the speedlimit is good enough for normal driving.

i need to work on my own driving.  im always creeping up on the speedometer and i need more experience.  im a nub to say the least.
Oct 23 2007 11:51PM
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Hedwig595
Posts: 76 - Karma: 6
16 year olds do need to drive places though, they have parents who work full time jobs, and if the kid has a job, it makes it hard, especially with extra curriculars and sports for school.  In NYS the new law makes it so you are closer to 17 when you do get your full license though, but still a limited one helps out.  If parents can't drive for whatever reason, theres a lot of variables, so saying that a 16 year old has no reason to drive is a bit of a general, broad sweeping statement.
Oct 23 2007 11:55PM
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Caveman.
Posts: 9067 - Karma: 330
very true i got my license when i was 15 and a freshman in high school as well. it is about experience not age
Oct 23 2007 11:56PM
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BigJew
Posts: 6974 - Karma: 79
I just got back from my first class of driver's training. I don't think that moving the age up to 18 would neccessarily change the amount of accidents. The main factor in how well you drive is experience, and distractions. There are 100% more crashes in new drivers when there are 2 or more people in the car than when driving alone. I don't think that age makes a huge difference. I agree that that a 12 year old can't be trusted to drive a car but at 16 I think most people are mature enough.
Oct 23 2007 11:58PM
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McTwist83
Posts: 282 - Karma: 11
I kind of agree with you. I had a pretty nasty wreck when i was 16 too. No one got injured thank god, and my truck wasn't totally totaled. Which was good, because its what i drive in the winter due to its 4x4..but I dunno, some kids i know my age are realy good drivers. like, I"m not saying i'm great or anything but this dude who i race with(racing league, not streets) is probably one of the best damn drivers i've ever seen. and he just turned 17. I think it depends on who you are...and yea, i've also had some one i know die i a vehicle accident...it wasn't pretty. We as teenagers just need to realise that we can't just become 'good' when did any of us wake up and just become rad at skiing or boardin? I think we just need to take it down, and build it up.
Oct 24 2007 12:07AM
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SkiMN
Posts: 4005 - Karma: 38
I agree with the point I see made the most, that you still have inexperienced drivers and therefore accidents. I do honestly think that the increase in maturity will at least in a few people, make a difference. The thing that I think could work with this idea is practice. You can require more behind the wheel training, longer than 1 year on the permit, and make the road test harder. Much harder.

I think that everybody is accident prone to a certain age. If you have 16 year olds out there you have them being extremely reckless in many cases for years. Yeah, the 18 year olds are gonna start out pretty green, but some of them move away from home, reality just sets in faster at that age.

Just some food for though. So far I'm impressed with the maturity level in here.
Oct 24 2007 12:11AM
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Mat.
Posts: 7167 - Karma: 94
yeah i agree entirely, 16 year olds just simply arent ready for the responsibility. if they get into a crash most cant actually afford to pay the insurance/damages done.
alot of kids totally take advantage of whats handed down to them from their parents as well. for example, crankking their music up when speakers can easily be broken by doing so. speeding/driving the car like an idiot not realizing how much lifespan theyre taking off the cars lifetime.
Oct 24 2007 12:11AM
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McTwist83
Posts: 282 - Karma: 11
'claps'

I think this could be the first NS thread i've seen that dosn't have any one figthing! Today is a very good day :P just thought i'd post in another thing, I was talking to a returned mormon missionary from someplace in euroupe a little bit ago, and they bassicly had the same compliants we do. So they made the driving test like nearly impossable to pass, most of us americans who've been driving for years couldn't even make it to 'round two' of their driving phase...like one mess up in there system and you can't have your licensce and need to pay money to test again.
Oct 24 2007 12:35AM
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french_fry
Posts: 4698 - Karma: 53
Great post dude, and very well put. I'm 18 and I'm in fact just learning how to drive right now even though I could have 2 years ago. I just never felt the need for it, and as someone pointed out, the need does NOT exist for almost anyone! I had stupid friends that were terrible drivers too. Car is not equal to independence, you still live at home and eat your mother's meals. It should be used more sparsely by EVERYONE. Walk, take the bus. Snow's melting fast every year anyways, so we will suffer the consequences...
Oct 24 2007 12:50AM
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Tinga
Posts: 11349 - Karma: 2,333
i think this would make for safer roads and the leading cause of deaths for teenagers is automobile accidents. But i dont think that half of us would be half as mature if we hadnt had the experience of driving at the age we did.
Oct 24 2007 12:54AM
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Tolz
Posts: 1882 - Karma: 27
i agree.
allow me to steal your thread a bit...

along the same lines, I do not understand why kids as young as 17 can enlist and eventually die for their country yet they can't vote, smoke, drink, or rent a car. I agree with the driving age needing to be raised but at the same time, other "important" ages need to be reconsidered. I'm 21 and I can't even rent a car to drive from Seattle to Whistler for my upcoming trip in January...sucky.
Oct 24 2007 2:11AM
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Hoodbum
Posts: 111 - Karma: 10
i kinda agree here. i bumped the curb, didnt look over my shoulder a couple times, and leaned into the crosswalk a bit and still passed...barely.  However i haven't gotten in any wrecks in my 2 years of driving. just 2 speeding tickets within 2 weeks of each other haha.
Oct 24 2007 3:26AM
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*V-Love*
Posts: 500 - Karma: 19

First ^ i love your icon!


Second raising the age wont work because of work. Most kids have to get jobs early now in order to afford a college education and there parents arent around to drive them here and there every day.

I agree with teenagers thinking nothings going to happen, its called egocentrism, but i think by requiring drivers ed, making the test harder, and not letting young kids go on traffic violations is a start....

Oct 24 2007 5:35AM
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Mr_Bojangles
Posts: 2585 - Karma: 16
Woah, you can drive at 15 in America, but can't drink until you're 21?

Raise driving age to 18, lower drinking age to 18, and you've got yourself a dope Aussie setup.
Oct 24 2007 5:57AM
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Lineskiah11
Posts: 2029 - Karma: 21

in all the states its different. some you can get your license at 16 and some you cant until your 16 1/2, then with permits some states allow you to get them when your 15 and others are 16. i dont know if they should raise the driving age because that wouldnt really solve the problem, but i think that they should require more experience before your on your own so at least your more comfortable and not apt to drive as wrecklessly.

Oct 24 2007 6:21AM
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Silence
Posts: 16030 - Karma: 150
yeah for sure..

I think you can get a commercial pilot's license at 16 too..wierd. - everything seems the opposite of what should happen!
Oct 24 2007 6:27AM
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Steezy_Street
Posts: 833 - Karma: 161
In my state in Aus u can get yur learners licence at 16 but u have to stay on them for a minumum of 1 year and u have to complete 120 hours of driving with a perosn who has a full licence. Not many people can do 120 hours in a year tho sinec u need yur dam parent in the car lol. But after that u dont get yur full licence u get a provisional licence for a year which means u can drive on yur own but cant go over 90 and only allowed 1 passengeer after 11pm. After than year u can do another test to get yur provisional 2 licence which is the same but u can go 100kph (60mph) and u get no pasenger restrictions, yur on P2 for 18 months and THEN  u can get yur full licence. its sooo strict and on yur L's and both P's u get no chances with the cops for speeding or anything u loose yur licence straight away for 5 months. ITS SHIT
Oct 24 2007 7:40AM
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MrScruff
Posts: 575 - Karma: 10
In the UK it's 17 to both learn and take your test.  The test is pretty tough, but even still you get some complete spackers getting through, I almost got killed by someone who drove right up onto the pavement where I was walking when they were trying to do a simple pull in and park. I don't think age is much of a factor, it's more to do with youth, so unless the age is raised significantly (ie. to 25 ish) they've just gotta be tougher with speeding and so on
Oct 24 2007 8:12AM
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snwbrdmilf
Posts: 22441 - Karma: 2,805
Hahaha, I'd have to say I agree with that homie.
Oct 24 2007 8:14AM
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SkierX
Posts: 16253 - Karma: 538
As a 22 year old, an age limit in theory would benefit me, however I don't think it would do anything.

The problem isn't age, it's experience and maturity, and 18 years old does not make someone more mature than a 16 year old.

I got my permit on my 16th birthday in June. My parents did not allow me to get my license until November of the following year, when i was 17. They wanted to ensure I had adequate driving experience, and that I had driven with supervision for a full winter. It made a massive difference. I am confident driving in all weather conditions, and am a responsible driver overall.

Two things need to change.
#1- Parents need to take more responsibility themselves and teach their children to drive better, relay the dangers and not allow them to get their license until they are certain they are responsible and experienced enough to drive

#2- The current drivers test is a complete joke. It takes very little skill to pass. It needs to be stricter.
Oct 24 2007 8:49AM
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Krush
Posts: 1312 - Karma: 12
im 2 months away form being 17, and have been driving since i was 14 and 8 months (the earliest you can start driving in MI). i have been in no accidents, no tickets, no warnings, no nothing. i agree with more education in drivers ed, but to keep even the responsible 16 year-olds from driving is unfair to them. dont let one bad apple ruin the bunch
Oct 24 2007 8:53AM
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snwbrdmilf
Posts: 22441 - Karma: 2,805
Yes, my parents were the exact same way. I got my permit on my 16th birthday. I had to wait a year, plus however long until they thought I was ready to handle driving on my own. Then I was allowed to take my test.

And yes, the test is a joke.
Oct 24 2007 9:35AM
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Redstar
Posts: 1698 - Karma: 9

Im 18 and I dont drive. I've got my permit and everthing, but like..fuck that shit freaks me out haha. I get so stressed at intersections and shit, especially when its busy and Im surrounded\

Oct 24 2007 9:45AM
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ISkiSwitch
Posts: 3157 - Karma: 22
I think they need a harder road test. Give the driver some extensive obstacle course, or make them drive in mildly heavy traffic. The road tests are too easy letting people on the road who still can't really drive, they just practiced 3point turns...
Oct 24 2007 10:19AM
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skiminnesota
Posts: 9093 - Karma: 429
hold on a sec... when i was 16 i had a summer job that required me to get up at 5:30 and drive 30 min... there is no way my mom should be driving me to work at 5:30 in the morning....

also i respect something my parents did, and that was when i first got my license   i was not allowed to have more people  than my brother in the car for about 6-8 months after
Oct 24 2007 10:47AM
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BigRodRiley
Posts: 1265 - Karma: 36
yes, exactly... the age wont change shit.
Oct 24 2007 10:48AM
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snwbrdmilf
Posts: 22441 - Karma: 2,805
I also wasn't allowed to have ANYONE in the car with me.
Oct 24 2007 10:54AM
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ax_murderer
Posts: 3322 - Karma: 30
legit arguement. i agree. and another test required when u turn a certain age. like 75. so many reatarded old people drive 
Oct 24 2007 11:29AM
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ISkiSwitch
Posts: 3157 - Karma: 22
x2
Oct 24 2007 12:34PM
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[]Soul_Steeze[]
Posts: 2357 - Karma: 61
we just discussed this the other day in political science.

we were thinkin that there needs to be some kind of test or something to determine when you are mature enough to drive, cuz i know plenty of 16 and 17 year old kids who are way more mature than some of my 19 and 20 yr old friends...it all depends

but yea props for puttin this out there   i agree
Oct 24 2007 12:37PM
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InvalidConflict
Posts: 100 - Karma: 10
i learned to drive when i was 9 and drove alot at my cottage till i got my learners and then my license

in my group of friends i am the only person to not get there car towed and havent got into any accidents and only two speeding tickets

its not age

its toatally expierence 
 
i also took drivers ed and that made a huge difference

kids now a days need more expierence behind the wheel
Oct 24 2007 12:49PM
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Itsbackfliptime
Posts: 18901 - Karma: 75
I got my permit at 14 years 9 months. I drove with my parents until my 16th birthday when I got my license. The only restrictions my parents put on me were the same ones that the law put on me like no driving after midnight until I turned 17. I think the problem is less with the law, and more with the parents. I drove with my parents for over a year before I got my license and they decided I could handle driving on my own. So far I've only gotten 1 speeding ticket (which was bullshit) and 1 accident (I was rear ended while turning). Its up to parents to raise their kids. Maybe we should even take a similar approach to drinking. Give kids a "learners permit" that allows them to drink from age 18-21 or something with their parents/guardians.
Oct 24 2007 12:51PM
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smuggsVT
Posts: 2145 - Karma: 19
there shouldn't be a set driving age, but rather a skill/maturity evaluatioin before kids are given the responsibility of getting behind the wheel.
Oct 24 2007 12:59PM
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Red_Shirt
Posts: 292 - Karma: 8
I definitely agree with you that most people are not mature enough to drive at 16. However, It is a lot easier to stay out past curfew in many states if you're in a car rather than just walking down the street. So, down with curfew laws. (Sorry, this was kinda off topic but I got arrested for curfew violation after getting dropped off a block away from my house and it pisses me off.)
Oct 24 2007 1:04PM
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Dan.
Posts: 7201 - Karma: 1,126
the best argument in here is to make the test an actual test of driving skill, I took the test here, and the test in the czech republic. The european driving tests are so ridiculous, I know of maybe two kids in the 400 of my graduating class who would have actually passed the test in europe, yet somehow, all 400 passed the American test.
Oct 24 2007 1:06PM
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Mat.
Posts: 7167 - Karma: 94
i disagree with whoever said "16 years dont need to be anywhere".
as i said i deffinatly feel that 16 year olds cant handle the responsibility or conquences for their actions at the age of 16. but another thing is that people have to be given the opportunity to gain experience in order to eventually live up to those standards. and whoever said an 18 year old isnt anymore mature than a 16 year old is absolutely right.
Oct 24 2007 1:14PM
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thelazyboy
Posts: 498 - Karma: 35
wow quebec's rules about that stuff are pretty damn relaxed compared to the states.

starting to learn how to drive a stick at 15. got a learners permit at 16 (had to drive with someone) for 8 months and had to take driving classes. than I got a real license, no after midnight or alone in the car. I say its experience much more than learning stuff. making the good decisions . the best thing for that in my opinion would be a MASSIVE road test. im talking like a good two hours of driving around with an instructor to make sure you know very well how to drive. I mean my only road exam lasted 15 minutes and that gave me a license i will have till I die. its a joke
Oct 24 2007 1:22PM
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Valind
Posts: 4358 - Karma: 17
They need to do something.  Kids get there DL and think they own the road or are "bulletproof".  I live in Colorado, every weekend teens are killed due to careless driving are "showboating". 

Yesterday this came across the scanner.....
10/23 7:35 pm Late Page/ Salida Hwy 285 on Poncha Pass closed all day due to a fatal T/A, 2 teenagers playing chicken hit H/O. //200//


Playing chicken?  That is crazy.  Way too many teens have been getting killed in accidents this year in Colorado.
Oct 24 2007 1:32PM
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bigwhite.steeze
Posts: 8227 - Karma: 1,030
i dont get my full license until im 17... when im 16 i still have to drive with a parent and when your 15 you just dream of being able to be behind the wheel...consider yrselves lucky to be driving so young. but it is a mixed blessing be3cause some people arent mature enough for that responsibility
Oct 24 2007 1:37PM
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