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Jacket question

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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
how high should a jackets breathability and waterproofing be to keep me warm in east coast conditions? and if a jacket is say 10K mm/5k breathability, does that mean itll be realatively warm? idk can someone explain it to me good so i know what im lookin at in a jacket (save the science (like gms/m2/24hrs) behind the whole thing nerds cause i dont care). thanks
Sep 23 2006 11:13PM
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rxvcgiii
Posts: 690 - Karma: -19
10k is always a safe bet...

You should consider the water content of your local snow. If you get true, DRY powder, you don't have to worry so much about a high waterproof rating because you can simply wipe the snow off your cloth's regardless. If you get wet snow, I'd stick with a higher waterproof rating, so that when that slushy shit hits you, it doesn't penetrate through.

I don't quite understand why people wear 5k in spring/slush conditions and 10-20k in powder... personally, I'd do the exact opposite. Powder will land on you and brush/fly right off as you ski... but when slush hits you, it sticks... and seeps through.

...But to each their own.
Sep 24 2006 1:03AM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
^well if you wore a 20k in slush ud be mad warm and have the sweatiest balls in america
Sep 24 2006 10:11AM
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rxvcgiii
Posts: 690 - Karma: -19
I think that's the common misconception. The waterproofness rating has nothing to do with warmness of a jacket (although it does directly relate to the breathability). I have a 30k Sessions GT2 shell which is quite a bit lighter than my insulated 5k Quicksilver jacket. On warmer slush days I'll wear the 30k shell and on colder powder days I'll wear the 5k insulated jacket.
Sep 24 2006 1:55PM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
so does that 5k insulated jacket have a higher breathability? something has to tell you how warm it is or no one would ever know how to buy a jacket
Sep 24 2006 7:21PM
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rxvcgiii
Posts: 690 - Karma: -19
As far as I know, the breathability rating is related to the size of the pores (microscopic openinings in the fabric) on the jacket. No fabric is perfectly solid, they all have pores. Jackets with larger pores, such as 5k rated jackets, will breathe easier and also allow more moisture to pass through (in AND out). Jackets with smaller pores, such as 20k rated jackets, will breathe with more difficulty and also prevent more moisture to pass through (in AND out).

As far as the WARMNESS rating, SHELL jackets technically aren't even made to keep you WARM, per se. They have no insulation factor. Insulated jackets have ratings on their insulation material, such as "150gm poly loft insulation". I'm really not sure how "warmness" is rated though...
Sep 24 2006 7:38PM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
sounds about right right, anyone know how to tell? or at least if theres a corrilation btw the wp and br numbers to help as a guide
Sep 24 2006 9:48PM
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Skipig25
Posts: 10729 - Karma: 256
there are seperate numbers for breathability and waterproofedness. the higher the better, and they usually coincide. If it is expressed as 20k, that usually means that they are both 20k. Some jackets it will say like 15k/20k, and that means that waterproof is 15 and breathablity is 20. So most of the time, higher jackets are more waterproof, AND breath more than the lower numbers
Sep 24 2006 9:51PM
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Lineskier-101
Posts: 7863 - Karma: 22
No offense Nomen, but saying you have to be "elite" to wear 20,000 waterproofiing is pretty stupid. It's not the skier that decides what clothes you need, it's the conditions.
Sep 24 2006 9:54PM
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rxvcgiii
Posts: 690 - Karma: -19
There is definitely a correlation between the waterproofness and breathabilty ratings; most of the time the numbers are the same, if not only 5k apart... but there is something that doesn't quite line up. If a jacket is rated at 20k for breathabilty, I'd imagine it doesn't breathe nearly as well as a 5k jacket. A 5k jacket has bigger pores in the fabric, which, while making it less waterproof, allows it to breath much easier.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I just don't understand how a HIGHER number on the breathability scale means that it breathes EASIER...
Sep 24 2006 10:09PM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
idk man but theres tons of nerds on here someones gotta know, nerds of ns help me out
Sep 25 2006 8:32PM
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fouldsys
Posts: 7404 - Karma: 39
nah b east coast you need like 20000 for all the fuckin RAIN we get.
Sep 25 2006 8:36PM
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uni-corn
Posts: 13846 - Karma: 651
That is the worst thing ever..
Sep 25 2006 8:49PM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
THe higher the first number, the moe water proof it is from the outside in...the higher the second number, the less waterproof it is from the outside out.

you want both numbers to be as high as you can afford...you'll get better waterproofness, and less sweat.
Sep 25 2006 8:50PM
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poofartpee
Posts: 7436 - Karma: 1,538
goo sdiscription...u asing L.A.?
Sep 25 2006 9:06PM
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poofartpee
Posts: 7436 - Karma: 1,538
*good
Sep 25 2006 9:06PM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
so in that case...high waterproofing and breathability would keep you warmest, which was my first preception. but, why would you need a high waterproofing to be warm if when its cold out the snow is dryer and you dont really need the waterproofing cause its ice not water
Sep 25 2006 9:51PM
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Campeador
Posts: 7516 - Karma: -1,227
10k is a good choice for a jacket. I wear 30k pants for the powder though. Pants need to be more waterproof than the jacket.
Sep 25 2006 10:29PM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
You dont really need a high waterproofing. I wear a 10k/5k jacket for all around, and a 20k/20k for spring and rain.

Theorheticly, you could have a trash bag on, and it would be infinte k for the waterproofing, but it wouldnt breathe for shit.
Sep 26 2006 8:55AM
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lyndon
Posts: 7266 - Karma: 128
uh, i have a question too...my jacket is 10K mm, and 7200 g/m2/24h somethign..whats that mean??
Sep 26 2006 3:17PM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
that just means that the waterproofing rating is 10,000mm and the breathability rating is 7200. they are just relative numbers...but regardless this is what im thinkin for all of this so far. i guess there isnt any connection with the wp and br ratings to warmth because they stand alone. the size of the number just relates to what is needed weather wise and doesnt mean the jacket is thin or warm or whatever. each company has their own little systems of determining the grade of the jackets like burtons different layer names and types of insulation and shit or they are simply rated by how much insulation they have in grams like down/puffys. i wish there was a uniform way but it really doesnt make sense for there to be one anymore. just use relativity...if this one is expensive and high end for this one brand, the one that is high end in another brand is going to be really similar. wow i just like wrote an essay but i dont wanna look at this thread anymore so laterrr
Sep 26 2006 8:52PM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
there are different kinds of insulation, but they are all usually rated by weight. The higher a weight, the warmer they will be, For example, any down jacket marked 750, will have more down in it than say a 550 jacket. For skiing, you wont need a down jacket higher than 650 EVER unless you are a patroller and do alot of standing around. Synthetic inulations are marked differently, but still follow the same rules, they higher the number the more of it and (in practice) the warmer it will be.
Sep 27 2006 10:16AM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
unless its a puffy then most dont have the weight with em
Sep 27 2006 5:40PM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
"or they are simply rated by how much insulation they have in grams like down/puffys."
Sep 27 2006 5:41PM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
it should always be rated...puffy or not...for example, mynorth face puffy is 550 fill with is perfect for under a hardshell.
Sep 27 2006 9:57PM
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boobie
Posts: 917 - Karma: 90
check some quiksilver or burton, they arent all rated by grams of insulation. the brands make their own little systems that dictate the warmth/protection compared to other coats sold by that brand
Sep 27 2006 10:28PM
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