The Drug War

oky doky then, some people support drugs and others dont...thats how it'll stay man

that is the most basic way of putting it, personally i don't feel like the goverment should have the right to fuck me over for smoking marijuana, or using any other drug i choose to use.

in a sense, this whole drug thing is just based on the American capitalist system. andother way it failed us.
but im sure that has ntohign to do with the movie which i didnt watch

MICRANOTS - ILLEGAL BUSINESS

^listen to it

awww boohoo, why don't you go smoke a joint and relax.

na i am going to wait untill after work tonight to smoke, not crying about it. just wondering how many people are ok with this issue and how it affects you and those you know.

I'm perfectly fine with the issue. I live my life as I would if the laws were any different. It's a drug that enough people can't control themselves with, so it's illegal. you gota deal with it dude.

there was a good show on history channel last night about drugs. basically they are so illegal becasue it started out that the governemnt banned cocaine becasue they said negroes got out of control on it. Now the government just takes it completely out of hand and casued the war we have now with drugs. Fucking bs

How about, you don't like it, MOVE!

haha ^ good idea dumbass

It is a good idea, actually dumbass. You don't like the way the country is run, don't bitch about it, either do something productive or leave. It's pretty simple and would make everybody's lives better.

i am so glad i can control my drinking, it is not like there are drinking and driving accidents all the time, or imagine all those people with self control sitting with a oxygen tank because of thier control of cigs.

you don't use ok, but you are ok with law enforcement stealing money, locking people away, and ruining lives A+ on the moral factor:)

I'm ok with the government doing what they need to to keep the country from becoming an entire country similar to Burlington, VT.

another example of BS this time from the un:

Marijuana use 'out of control’ worldwide: UN official
(AP)

27 June 2006


WASHINGTON - Marijuana use worldwide is “out of control” because it grows everywhere, is in high demand and erroneously is considered by many to be harmless, a senior United Nations official said on Monday.

Antonio Maria Costa, executive director of the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, highlighted the marijuana problem at a news conference as he released his office’s 2006 World Drug Report.

Marijuana, also known as cannabis, is a danger because it contains increasingly potent amounts of THC, a banned substance, Costa said.

While governments around the world generally have succeeded in containing use of heroin, cocaine and amphetamines, Costa said marijuana is a different story.

Marijuana, he said, “is out of control.”

“It’s out of control in supply because it’s a weed; it grows everywhere. It’s out of control in demand because it’s erroneously considered a light drug.”

John Walters, head of the White House Office of National Drug Control Policy, agreed that marijuana is “a massive global problem.”

“It’s not just a gateway, it is a dead end as well as an opening for many other people who go on and use other things, and are polydrug users. It has been for a long time,” said Walters, who joined Costa at the news conference.

The UN report released by Costa generally was upbeat, boasting gains - including that opium poppy cultivation was down 22 percent in 2005.

On the negative side, the report found that cocaine use is reaching alarming levels in Western Europe.

It attributed the decline in opium poppy cultivation to cutbacks in the three main source countries of illicit opium in the world: Afghanistan, Myanmar and Laos. Opium is the main ingredient for heroin.

“In Afghanistan, in 2005, opium poppy cultivation decreased for the first time since 2001,” the report said. Still, it said, that country accounted for 89 percent of opium production worldwide.

The State Department’s annual report on illicit drugs, issued in March, acknowledged that opium production is hampering democracy-building efforts in Afghanistan.

“Afghanistan’s huge drug trade severely impacts efforts to rebuild the economy, develop a strong democratic government based on rule of law, and threatens regional stability,” the report said.

Despite the sharp decrease in the total area under cultivation in all opium-producing countries, the UN report said production was down only 5 percent due to more favorable weather conditions during the 2005 growing season in Afghanistan.

“The world’s supply of opium has shrunk, but in an unbalanced way,” the study said. “Within a few years, Asia’s notorious Golden Triangle, once the world’s narcotics epicenter, could become opium-free. But in Afghanistan, while the area under opium cultivation decreased in 2005, the country’s drug situation remains vulnerable to reversal. This could happen as early as 2006.”

Assessing the gamut of illicit drugs, from heroin to cocaine as well as marijuana, amphetamines and ecstasy, the report concluded: “Drug control is working, and the world drug problem is being contained.”

Levels of drug cultivation and drug addiction are much lower than they were 100 years ago, it said.

“Even more importantly, in the past few years, worldwide efforts to reduce the threat posed by illicit drugs have effectively reversed a quarter-century-long rise in drug abuse that, if left unchecked, could have become a global pandemic,” the report added.

baha fuckin stoners. God forbid somebody doesn't like kids smoking themselves retarded!

you completely missed the point of the article, in fact i doubt you even read it... just like i doubt you even started the movie.

I actually wasn't referring to the article, I was referring to you guys getting so pissed off about drug laws. But I must apologize, if you want to be an idiot, feel free; not my juncture. Just be glad somebody's concerned with your health and wellbeing, even if you aren't. Enjoy your thread fellas.

will do, thanks for leaving.

i like weed

Yeah, I'd much rather see marijuana be legal than cigarettes or aspartame.

The reason I'm pissed about the War on Drugs isn't because I'm a user and want the freedom to do it. Instead I'm pissed off because my tax money is being used to fight a hopeless battle against a relatively harmless substance.

i don't know if any one has actully watched the movie but it is really good. they bring a lot of issues to light that are really messed up. also the movie is in english after the intro.

woah woah, hey now, what's wrong with Burlington?

If the government was that serious about protecting our health, then cigarettes and alcohol would be far more illegal than weed. To have a valid opinion on this issue, you need to know a little more than they taught you in DARE. Educate yourself with some unbiased sources such as Erowid or any of a multitude of medical studies.

In theory, America is a democracy, and is run by public opinion. Thus, sharing ideas and information with others is doing something about it, and is the basis of how our country was designed to work.

-woah woah, hey now, what's wrong with Burlington?

I hate living in Burlington and cannot wait until next summer, when I will be out of here. It’s far too ‘speak your mind’ for me.

-If the government was that serious about protecting our health, then cigarettes and alcohol would be far more illegal than weed. To have a valid opinion on this issue, you need to know a little more than they taught you in DARE. Educate yourself with some unbiased sources such as Erowid or any of a multitude of medical studies.

_Alcohol… They tried; does prohibition ring a bell?
_Cigs; 13-27% of adults in every state (http://smokingsides.com/docs/us_adults_bystate95) smoke. Try making that illegal and see what happens.
_So everybody who doesn’t agree with you must be biased and uneducated eh?

-In theory, America is a democracy, and is run by public opinion. Thus, sharing ideas and information with others is doing something about it, and is the basis of how our country was designed to work.

_Opinions in which are acted upon, not just projected; if every opinion that was ever stated mattered, we wouldn’t have our country.


later boys.

well, agree to disagree on Burlington, but I think that your point on cigs being legal cause lots of people smoke is kind of bull. That argument is pretty much a cop out. Plus there are almost, if not equally, as many people who smoke marijuana as those who smoke cigarettes.

Can you honestly think of a way to make cigs illegal without millions of people tryin to kill you? It doesn't matter if as many people smoke pot, that's illegal as is, you don't have to make it illegal. Look what happened in prohibition, they made it illegal and it didn't work.

right, it wouldn't work. just like the war on drugs doesn't work. I think we are on the same page.

hah yep. Good deal.

Cocaine was amazingly popular even among prohibitionists and people campaigning against opiates. In the 70s/80s, one of the drug czars for the president (can't remember who) wanted to legalize coke, and actually was fired for being caught using it in office. Clearly, popularity isn't everything.

I never said anything about people disagreeing with me being biased. Try and deny that DARE is biased. According to them, if you smoke pot once, your life will be ruined. Erowid might be slightly biased, but not much. They basically just have concise summarys of what we know about different drugs, including both the positive and negative effects. And medical studies are not necessarrily biased in one way or another. I will admit i find the correlation between weed and schitzophrenia disturbing, and I learned of this from medical journals. Before you assume everyone is basing their arguements off of arbitrary assumptions and bad information, think about what we're actually saying, and what you're basing your response off of.

I would love to have a more intelligent and in-depth discussion with you about this, but right now it feels like you are taking entire ideas, and dismissing them with petty, and mostly irellevant generalizations.

According to DARE, I'm a lost cause. I've smoked 3 times, twice when I was drunk (of the 10 or so times ever). I'm taking entire ideas and giving them explanations because they don't necessarily need to be dissected and discussed in a point for point matter.

And I have no desire to talk about drugs with you, I have better things to do with my life. Thanks though.

you have pretty much said it your self, they tried prohibition and it did not work.... and what are they going for again? you got it. in the movie they give you a really scarry perspective, 1 out of 4 black males are custody either in jail/prison or on probation/parole... pretty messed up when you consider how bed off the families of those imprisoned.

interesting..

this seems to be a discussion about pot, and then another discussion about all other drugs.it probably would not hurt to legalize pot, but there is no "standard" high, green affects everyone differently. for most people they can control themselves, but there are exceptions who freak out/ high ass it/ do stupid shit. yes thats the same scenario for alcohol i know. nugs are a gateway drug however, this has been proven. alcohol tends not to be, atleast not on such a large scale.please dont say weed isnt a gateway drug, b/c it is a fact. on the other hand cigarettes are also somewhat a gateway, again not on such a large scale as weed.

for the individuals saying ALL drugs should be legalized, come on now be rational. for the most part, drugs ruin lives. the disadvantages of coke use outweigh the benefits. people in fact do go crazy off of coke/heroin or whatever, if you dont think so i can reasonably assume you dont/havent had peers who are/were addicted. we, as a society, are better off keeping hard drugs illegal. this will not change.

legalizing drugs would stop gang violence, make drugs cheaper, and save our gov't abundant funds which could be spent on much better issues, universal healthcare for instance, or we could raise the minimum wage. nonetheless, drugs are bad for you, and i honestly dont think the majority of the population would be able to handle legalized drugs, cause basically people, on average, are stupid.

I think the idea behind legalizing all drugs is that, rather than wasting money on punsishing these non-violent crimes, the money could be spent on more effective rehabilitation centers. I mean, it doesnt really make sense to be ruining peoples lives (along with their families) by putting them in jail just because they were doing a drug that was ruining their life. It doesn't accomplish anything.

point taken. however, ever heard the term "coke baby"? as well, using hard drugs isnt a violent crime, but the use causes violent crimes to be performed. i forgot to mention anything about money being wasted on prisons. this is a hard issue to tackle. no current solution seems to be very good, rehab centers dont really work all that well either.

i just think its a shame so many people cant handle their lives, and cant recognize when shits goin downhill. glad its not me.

use of hard drugs causes violent crimes because drugs are run on the black market, if some one had the option of living in a goverment ran system where they were provided with living area, food, a place to purchase drugs, and a job to support them selves instead of being forced into crime they would not? if some one wants to be a addict let them, when it is time for them to die they have to die, let them live thier lives the way they want to. just provide a reasonable way for them to support them selves and you kill two birds with one stone, keeping them happy and keeping everyone else safe.

john gotti said it the best when they asked him if he was into drug dealing

"no way, you cant compete with the government"

lol that is a david icke video...david icke thinks we have invisible reptiles riding on our backs. David Icke is the man.

care to elaborate on this correlation?

Whoa, whoa, whoa did you say Erowid was unbiased? Erowid is definately a biased source. It is a "drug" site. Medical studies would be a good thing in multitude. Don't just look at one study.

Did you guys know the constitution originally stated all drugs would remain legal? God bless our four fathers, but they know nothing and we know everything.

I don't really think Erowid is very biased. It clearly states the positive and negative effects of drugs, with little commentary or favoritism. Example from site:
EFFECTS LIST #
The effects of smoking Cannabis are usually lighter than those of many other recreational psychoactive substances. People are generally capable of carrying out normal actions and activities while high.


POSITIVE
mood lift, euphoria
laughter
relaxation, stress reduction
creative, philosophical or deep thinking : ideas flow more easily
increased appreciation of music. More aware of, deeper connection to music.
increased awareness of senses. (eating, drinking, smell)
change in experience of muscle fatigue. Pleasant body feel. Increase in body/mind connection.
pain relief (headaches, cramps)
reduced nausea, increased appetite (used medically for this)
boring tasks or entertainment can become more interesting or funny
NEUTRAL
general change in consciousness (as with many psychoactives)
increased appetite, snacky-ness
slowness (slow driving, talking)
change in vision such as sharpened colors or lights
closed-eye visuals (somewhat uncommon)
tiredness, sleepiness, lethargy
stimulation, inability to sleep (less common)
blood shot eyes (more common with certain varieties of cannabis and inexperienced users)
mouth dryness, sticky-mouth (varies with strain)
interrupts linear memory. Difficulty following a train of thought.
cheek, jaw, facial tension / numbness (less commonly reported)
racing thoughts (especially at high doses)
increased emotional impact of music
Time sense altered: cars seem like they are moving too fast, time dilation and compression are common at higher doses
NEGATIVE
nausea, especially in combination with alcohol, some pharmaceuticals, or other psychoactives
coughing, asthma, upper respiratory problems
difficulty with short term memory during effects and during periods of frequent use
racing heart, agitation, feeling tense
mild to severe anxiety
panic attacks in sensitive users or with very high doses (oral use increases risk of getting too much)
headaches
dizziness, confusion
lightheadedness or fainting (in cases of lowered blood pressure)
paranoid & anxious thoughts more frequent
possible psychological dependence on cannabis
clumsiness, loss of coordination at high doses
can precipitate or exacerbate latent or existing mental disorders
WITHDRAWAL SYMPTOMS
mild to moderate, non life-threatening withdrawal symptoms occur after daily use in some users. These may last for 1-6 weeks after cessation of use and can include anxiety, anhedonia (reduced experience of pleasure), headaches, general unease/discomfort, difficulty sleeping, and a desire to smoke pot. Severity of symptoms is related to frequency of use and individual sensitivity.
slight loss of appetite
finding non-stoned life a bit dull, increased boredom

Uhhh, you seem pretty confident, so i hate to disagree with you, but it has in no way been "proven" that marijuana is a gateway drug. The entire concept of gateway drugs is rediculous. Saying that one substance leads to another makes some sense, but if you follow the chain, sugar would be a gateway drug.
Here's a pattern of "gateway drug use" (I'm defining drugs as anything that effects your mind)
Sugar>caffeine>tylenol>alcohol>cigarettes>marijauna>shrooms/salvia etc>harder drugs

Why pick on weed, when alcohol and cigarettes are just as much "gateway drugs"

It is a site run by drug users, it is biased. It may not be extreme, but it is biased. My point is pretty much everything besides medical studies is biased.

yeah, it's somewhat biased, but in general it has a wealth of facts and opinions based off legitimate scientific evidence, which is very different than the level of bias in many of the anti-drug propaganda programs.

best post in the thread

http://m.reason.com/26819/show/b5fa3379c93bc41758fe7ab9d9fb7969/

Not a terribly long read

Oh look, this thread again.
Please, anyone who is in any way pro-drug war or against drug legalization, I'll happily explain why you are wrong.

i think light drugs and other stuff should beleagal

Why not all drugs?