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French Riots

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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/spiegel/0,1518,383623,00.html

This seems to be heading towards the biggest crisis france had had since Algeria. This is definitely the end of Chirac, but could it also be the end of the 5th République?

The way i see it, if two kids are stupid enough to run from police, and hide in an electrical unit, they deserve to die, and it is in no way the polices fault.

but now all the tensions anyone has ever had are coming out, and all the problems that France has are all the more apparent.

sad.
Nov 7 2005 8:30AM
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KEVTRON
Posts: 3545 - Karma: 1,222
i dont liek the frech or germans
Nov 7 2005 8:31AM
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prophet
Posts: 4734 - Karma: 1,007
its not sad, its culture clash and failure of globalization. it probably just will mean a rise in conservative politics in europe in the short term. beside that i really dont know, "solving" christian/muslim conflict which is apparently the basis for a lot of this... outside of good ol racism... hasnt come around in 2000 years and its not likely to start now. i dont know the situation at all but this author makes it sound like the immigrants want special favors, which seems stupid when moving to a country with an opposing majoriy... i would think youd go there because you had some desire to be like those who are there. whatever, i dont know what im talking about. maybe theyll burn down paris.
Nov 7 2005 8:56AM
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hendrik.
Posts: 6715 - Karma: 267
not fucking funny^

One of my friends almost got the shit kicked out of him/killed, but ducked into a building in time....

This subject hits home with me because i lived there for a long time, and still have a lot of friends there. The death of the two fucktards in the electrical sub station was entirely their own fault. I mean come on, who in their right mind would do shit like that?

The thing is, tensions have almost always been high, and that incident was the straw that broke the camel's back. Unemployment rates in the 'burb's are ridiculously high, and the inhabitants feel they are being ostracized because of their race, which is true, because most of them fit the stereotype of being a little bitch-ass thug. These people walk around Paris, and will mug you for all of the possessions you have on your body, with groups as high as 40 against three or four people. These people deserve what they have, most of them are illegal immigrants. Fuck them
Nov 7 2005 9:01AM
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prophet
Posts: 4734 - Karma: 1,007
whats not funny, burning down paris? who said it was funny?
Nov 7 2005 9:03AM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
most of the noprth african people i have ever met fit that stereotype. pretending osme great injustice has been made to them when they get called racaille, when all they do is act like thugs.

but the problem of education with no jobs later on is a big problem.
Nov 7 2005 9:05AM
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Caramba
Posts: 122 - Karma: 10
thast the whole point, the motto of france is 'liberte, egalite, fraternite' = 'freedom, equality, brotherhood' and there is no legal distinction between immigrants and 'natives', everyone is just 'french'. The people rioting are pissed off because they're treated worse than 'native' french people when legally everone should be treated the same.
Nov 7 2005 12:27PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
they're pissed because:
_they feel they have the obligation to be (like rebelling teenagres: ima teen, im gonna rebvel, ohh yeah!)
_they move to france and the parents cannot work, due to language, lack of training etc, so they don't have much money and live in the projects (which makes me wonder: how do they manage to buy all of the nike air max shoes 130€ ? ive never gotten that)
_many, many fail at school, making them social rejects because thats how the elitist society in france is, but that is the same as all french kids, then add racism from this semi-hermit nation that is widespread towards immigrants (remember LePen got to the second round of elections)
_those who do make it in school get out and realize: oh dang! thats right! theres a 9% unemployment rate in France, therefore almost no jobs, and a not so booming economy to give them to us! so they're pissed along the same lines as the average french person too.
_ the jobs that are available are the ones none of the cushy french want, so they end up woking sanitation and construction for measily pay.
_ then add that paris area is densely populated, and expensive

bam.
Nov 7 2005 12:45PM
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hendrik.
Posts: 6715 - Karma: 267
et merde alors....

those bitches walk around paris looking for an excuse to start trouble. Take the Student protests a little while back. Compleletly peacefull till some 'cailles showed up and started breaking shit.

fils de pute.
Nov 7 2005 1:13PM
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l337
Posts: 1244 - Karma: 14
I didnt hear anything in the american media untll the ninth day of rioting. But the bbc had it on tv for a long time.


FUCK AMERICAN MEDIA

VIVA LA REVELOTION
Nov 7 2005 4:55PM
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JazzyJ
Posts: 3233 - Karma: 18
im going this february
Nov 7 2005 4:55PM
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JoeTheRipper
Posts: 1567 - Karma: 14
well maybe because it effects england much more drastically than it effects the U.S, because of its proximity, but also because it is part of the e.u
Nov 7 2005 5:32PM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
Die! i thought skiing was a kind of life style too...I mean why are we all talking to each other...exchanging stuff about skiing world politics and all that crap...cuz it doesnt matter where we are from...all that matters is that we like to ski...you should go back in your shithole and think about your attitude..so many hicks on this website have no clue about life..they have probably never seen a german or a french before...and if probably on televison...and they have definitely never been to that country..if you say u hate someone...you should at least know their culture
Nov 7 2005 5:55PM
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freeskier0808
Posts: 1748 - Karma: 16
fuck yeah!

peace
Nov 7 2005 5:56PM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
the problem rather is that there is no way to stop them they havent said what they want...its not organized they just have fun burning down cities...there is no one the police could talk to like a political leader or so...
last night the first cars burned in Berlin,Bremen in Germany..it is so weird..
Nov 7 2005 6:03PM
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mnjib
Posts: 5592 - Karma: 362
thats just outside the city my buddie is at. most of the roits are in the gehttos, but he says you can tell somethings up cuz at night no one is out on the steets.
Nov 7 2005 6:17PM
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dan.b
Posts: 866 - Karma: 10
"qui pètent toutes les esti de francais..."
gilles proulx
Nov 7 2005 6:45PM
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pierceme
Posts: 1483 - Karma: 11
so many kids at my school say the french suck all the time and shit and it pisses the hell out of me. Cuz honestly, what the hell has france and/or any european country done to us. Well besides helping us win our revolutionary war so we're even a country in the first place. I hate ignorant fucks.
Nov 7 2005 6:58PM
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whattheshit
Posts: 6562 - Karma: 107
france vetoed the war on iraq because they felt it would be in their best intrest not to distrupt the oil production in the french owned refineries/fields.
Nov 7 2005 7:55PM
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pierceme
Posts: 1483 - Karma: 11
yeah, that doesnt mean shit. I mean, how can we blame them for not wanting to go to a war that half of the people in this country didnt even want to fight. And whenever europe or anywhere says shit about the us we say that its not the people, its the government. Then we go and say things like fuck french people. Ur being a douchebag if u say shit like that with no facts whatsoever.
Nov 7 2005 8:27PM
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french_fry
Posts: 4698 - Karma: 53
Almostaskier, I think your opinions are similar to what most french people think, i agree with some of it, but it's also why it's not going forward and has come to such a ridiculous point. Of course, im not acknowledging what is happening, that useless violence under the pretext of 2 of theirs who died of their own stupidity. Those little thugs that burn cars are just "merdeux" that need some ass kicking and an education, and i'm not going to deny that a lot of them are north african, actually almost all of them. Immigration in France is not regulated, that's what the big problem is(not that i want less people to immigrate, but things done for helping people integrate if they're accepted, like in Canada where everybody cohabits peacefully). You're letting a load of people in your country without providing more jobs. After a few years and a generation, these people have the french citizenship but still don't have a job. The parents don't do their job, have more kids, let them wander on the streets, and there we go, all regrouped in those "cites", the violence escalates from those uneducated little fucks that end up stealing scooters and burning schools for no reason. But think about it, if you've watched the news, some of the people from those cites had a very clear message, about wanting the same jobs and opportunities and finally being integrated in the french society. A lot of french people are racist and don't want change or immigration, and it ends up going in a circle, and when now the circle is being broken the wrong way...I bet french people are going to disregard north african people even more now...
Nov 7 2005 8:57PM
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riderslodge_nz
Posts: 49 - Karma: 10
ignorant dumbass!
racist shit!
Nov 7 2005 9:30PM
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whattheshit
Posts: 6562 - Karma: 107
thats nice, what does it have to do with vetoing the war due to french oil refineries in iraq. just like all the others you fall back on half the country not going to war. please, i don't want any more milk from that cow. i have had too much.

you are the one being a douche bag because you are trying to argue but not presenting any information to support your arguement.
Nov 7 2005 11:54PM
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Kevo
Posts: 2374 - Karma: 136
This is what happens when you have lax immigration policies and you allow a population of people who have an entirely different culture into an already reestablished culture. It’s the Muslims burning France today; it is going to be the same thing with Mexicans burning America in the next 20 years. I do enjoy the fact that France is getting stabbed in the back after collaborating with the Muslim world for so long.
Nov 8 2005 12:07AM
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Rich
Posts: 921 - Karma: 11
well some people argue that oil was one of the reasons that the US DID go to war...surely that's just as bad??
Nov 8 2005 12:12AM
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whattheshit
Posts: 6562 - Karma: 107
wow where did you hear this theory from?

cnn???? michael moore?
Nov 8 2005 12:13AM
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french_fry
Posts: 4698 - Karma: 53
^^^see, you are very conservative about this because that's exactly what my grandparents say(most of my family actually lived in French Algeria until the war of 63(i think?)). Now they're all quite racist, but I can understand them since their land and belongings has been destroyed and people have been slaughtered by another culture 40 years ago, but I don't think you have a very good reason to believe this. The problem is to have the people integrate a different culture in their country, which they have a lot of trouble to do, and really isn't that big of a deal, instead of not letting anybody else immigrate...
Nov 8 2005 1:12AM
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Kevo
Posts: 2374 - Karma: 136
The issue isn't not letting people immitgrate, the issue is not letting people into your country who have no desire to integrate and end up being drains on society (e.g. the Muslims in France and a large portion of the immigrant Mexican community in the US). It has nothing to do with racism either, it has to do with people who move someplace not to become a citizen of that place, but to try to reap the benefits of it for themselves and their community. The Mexicans who cross the border don't want to be Americans like the immigrants of the 19th and early 20th century, they want to set up little Mexico wherever they go and not learn English or be Americans.
Nov 8 2005 2:05AM
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SmoKinSkier
Posts: 5501 - Karma: 20
honestly dont post that was completely and utterly irrelavent and useless!!
Nov 8 2005 2:14AM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
oh come on..both reasons are theories of ppl wanting to state the opposite thing europe says the US did the war because they wanted more oil...the Americans say we didnt enter the war because we wanted to save our oil...in fact germany didnt enter it because our cancelor had elections that year and he knew that people didn't like the war and used it to get votes..that's proven that he won the elections because of that...the french I dont really know about them but the government didnt agree with the US's opinion because they didnt think the reasons were good enough (same as the whole UN) and they knew that there ppl wouldn't like losing soldiers to a war like that...
Nov 8 2005 8:28AM
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freezed
Posts: 12973 - Karma: 500
there is no problem with france's loose policy on immigration. the problem, as others have said, is that the immigrants do NOTHING positive for the french society, and put a strain on it. Now these 2nd and 3rd generation immigrants feel like they are entitled to something because they are full on french citizens.

like someone said, this is going to happen in america eventually. i'm not joking about this, nor am i racist, but eventually, states like california are just going to be mostly mexican, because they keep moving there, but refusing to even attempt to integrate.

its all very frustrating.
Nov 8 2005 11:19AM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
yeah if you live in a country you have to accept its mentality, society and culture..and of course adapt to the language
Peter Salins wrote in his book "Assimilation" that there are 3 main things about it:
1. adopt national language
2. become pride of their new country
3.hardworking and morally upright

the 3rd one is what we are talking about...people who just take and dont give back to the community and they should actually go back to where they came from...the working ones can stay cuz they offer something to the commmunity
Nov 8 2005 3:10PM
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french_fry
Posts: 4698 - Karma: 53
So, tell me why Canada isn't a chaotic country? So many people from different cultures, and they all try and save their cultures in the country too... You are not fully wrong, when immigration from one specific place is massive, people tend to think they're home among theirs. But still, I think the people on their part do not loosen up their opinions and stereotypes...
Nov 8 2005 10:54PM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
it's way more complicated than we probably understand but as far as I see it and see it in my country...those come to a country sit on their ass and say "immigrate me" thats not what the country has to do..they have to work their butts off and make an effort...and if they dont do so they get stuck with their fellows who do the same thing..
the difference to canada is that those ppl have a job and an option..and they are willing to use it..and the french accept more immigrants than the canadians I think...but I'll check it later on
Nov 9 2005 8:06AM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
alright alright I just checked it I am wrong...Canada accepts 20000 legal immigrants...
which is number 2 in the world and #1 if u look at the ratio of how many ppl they have and how many they accept
France has like 4 Millions in total cant really find how many they get each year...
Nov 9 2005 9:38AM
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DANETRON
Posts: 6671 - Karma: 137
i think that its cool that they are standing up for what they believe in like the inequality and shit but i think that rioting over some stupid kids that killed them selves is idiotic.
Nov 9 2005 9:40AM
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sherpasrock
Posts: 2382 - Karma: 10
indeed it is. i was watching tv and i forget what channel i was watching or who said it but its like, some people who come to America dont even bother to learn english, its like they dont even try to integrate. they think that we should adapt to them, but they came here, so at least try to do stuff like learn english and integrate. im not saying everyone that moves here does that, its just that it seems to be a growing problem around the world.
Nov 9 2005 9:49AM
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DANETRON
Posts: 6671 - Karma: 137
i hate that shit like when they change the names of streets to spanish and make us have 7 different languages on boxes.

learn to speak english or get out.
Nov 9 2005 9:54AM
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WVskier1080
Posts: 50 - Karma: 15
that seems pretty intense...i am pretty sure i hate the french
Nov 9 2005 9:57AM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
it is whereever ppl show up in groups..if you make them settle one by one between citizens...they would do fine and adapt
Nov 9 2005 12:29PM
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Rich
Posts: 921 - Karma: 11
10% of the population of the US speak spanish as a first language! 10%!!
Nov 9 2005 12:30PM
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Drunkenmaster
Posts: 435 - Karma: 9
welcome to a globalized and travelling world...
Nov 9 2005 12:40PM
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Kevo
Posts: 2374 - Karma: 136
Well, I guess the difference is that when the Mexicans in the Us do the same thing in the next 20 years people in the US won't stand for it. If hords of Mexican teenagers burn cars and schools and stuff, they are going to get shot.


On a side note, has anyone esle noticed that Islam and Muslims (the fundamentalist ones in particular) are the plague that is attempting to choke modern society? The goal of the fundamentalists is to pretty much take us back to the stone age with Islamic Law, and the nonfundamentalists aparantly enjoy burning down western countries, like France for instance. Where is this religion of peace? Where are the charities and the equivelant to the salvation army in this religion? What is one thing- ONE THING that the Arab/Muslim world has done to advance human society in the last 500 years? Hell, in the last 1300 years since Islam began?
Nov 9 2005 4:02PM
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Kevo
Posts: 2374 - Karma: 136
Oh and apparently it is cool to walk into wedding parties in Amman and blow yourself up if you are a Muslim. What a religion Islam is! What a culture the Arabs have! What a religion of peace!
Nov 9 2005 4:07PM
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lineskier10
Posts: 11339 - Karma: 796
good point, the muslims really havent done shit
Nov 9 2005 4:09PM
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KingShit
Posts: 4483 - Karma: 7
wow, I can't believe I'm reading this on NS. Somebody with the same view on Muslims as me... Is it my by b-day today or something?
Nov 9 2005 4:12PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
i don't agree with this. how can you possibly generalize so much about a varied and complicated population?

you can't say that ALL muslims are participating in the riots, as well as you can't say that all the people in the riots are muslims. Thats like saying all roman catholics agree with the Crusades, that all christians blindly follow the Pope, and that everyone that participated in the saint bartholemew massacre represents what christianity is about. Sure, these all involve religious people of a certain beliefe, but does it show everyones motives, or account for the majority of believers?

also, in todays world, many religious people that i meet are just self proclaimed so, when they don't follow the code of their religion. so you can say: that dude is a muslim, he's throwing rocks, therefore muslims are hateful, and he'll tell you he is a muslim, but does it mean he is following what his religion teaches him? likewise a hindu kid beating another up doesn't show what the religion states.

Hate is everywhere, and i can tell you, many muslim kids in France are hateful, but not just muslim ones, and racism is rampant. Its not the most peaceful place ever.

And muslim sates are not a plague that is destroying modernity: look at Dubai man.
Nov 9 2005 4:16PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
and could it be possible that religious extremists don't account for all of a religion? i don't like Islam in general, because according to it i deserve to be killed since i don't believe in the unity of God (Father, Son, Holy Ghost= not one), and its true it is not very peaceful in general, but i mean, can you categorize all christians with www.godhatesfags.com ??

its not fair to a people to judge them on their bad sides alone.
Nov 9 2005 4:19PM
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Kevo
Posts: 2374 - Karma: 136
First of all, I said fundamentalists are into bombing and trying to impose Islamic law and take us back to the stone age, not muslims as a whole. I did say that Islam is a plague in the modern world, which it pretty much is. I did also say that Muslims are rioting in France, which they are. Did I say all the Muslims in France are rioting? NO Did I say everyone who is rioting in France is Muslim? No, but most are. The fact is that for some reason it is much more acceptable in that culture for to participate in things that lead to social unrest like riots and even...dare I say...JIHAD.

So the question stands-What is ONE THING that the Muslims religion or Arab culture has done to advance human society in the last 1,300 years?
Nov 9 2005 4:27PM
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Kevo
Posts: 2374 - Karma: 136
And when was the last time that somebody from Godhatesfags walked into a wedding, or schoolyard, or bus station, or restaurant, or nightclub, or office building and blew themself up in the name of their religion? Somebody is going to bring up Ireland in this, but that was an isolated incided that was more polical than religious. The Islam problem is worldwide, not just in a corner of a small country.
Nov 9 2005 4:31PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
this seems to be a pretty big over generalization man, hence my previous post.

if you ignore the art and culture of ENTIRE CIVILZATIONS, in Iraq, Iran, Mesopotamia in general, then i agree, not much.
Nov 9 2005 4:33PM
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