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Ski clothing companies still don't get ti

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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
wow...another news item on the front page... a new ski clothing company. ambush clothing. i check their website out, and what do you know, another huge dissapointment.

click t-shirts - all you get to see is the picture that I'm guessing is screened on the front of the shirt. Same with the hoodies. Jerseys? coming soon. Seriously, if I wanted screen printed fruit of the loom shirts, I'd photoshop something and make them myself. And I don't want to buy things from companies without a picture of the product. Please, if you're going to start a company, can you start a real one? And get designers, and creative people that know how to make clothing, and actually cut fabric?

To quote from the sublux interview, I have tremendous respect for the lifestyle companies in other sports. However, skiers need to realize when they buy from these companies, or some clothing store at the mall, they are not supporting skiing. When you buy from Sublux, your money goes back into the ski industry.

Do you really need to try to make kids feel bad about buying clothing from the mall so you can sell your lame ass walmart hoodie? Guess what, go to pacific sunwear, arguably a pretty "poser" store, and the hoodies there are way sicker than any ski hoodie i've seen (except for maybe siver, which i have some respect for).

But anyway, I don't even get the point of the argument. Who cares about "supporting skiing" by buying clothing. Last time I checked, the mountains will be open in a month, I have skis, and I'll be able to go skiing. What difference does it make if buy a sublux hoodie or not. You know the best way in my book to "support" skiing? Go ski.
Oct 4 2005 4:38AM
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FullClip09
Posts: 102 - Karma: 10
Funny good point i like your style.
Oct 4 2005 4:41AM
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dylhole
Posts: 2926 - Karma: 983
i agree, i dont really undestand how you make a ski specific softgoods product only.
what does that have to do with actual skiing.
at least siver makes outerwear
Oct 4 2005 4:59AM
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Audioslave
Posts: 253 - Karma: 28
Yeah thats a very good point. Lots of companies just use that slogan so people buy their lame t-shirts and hoodies. I guess if you buy softgoods from Armada, Line, 4Frnt, etc. you might support skiing somewhat, but not if you buy clothing from companies that dont even make skis.
Oct 4 2005 11:05AM
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sivercartel7
Posts: 310 - Karma: 10
When you buy from Siver you support skiing, ever look at who sponsors ski videos? or who puts on rail jams? or who puts on Siver Sesssions, or the young gun open? Siver sponsors all of these and they all give back to skiing.
Oct 4 2005 11:17AM
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johanblaze
Posts: 4987 - Karma: 345
i know what you mean man. i just bought a 4frnt hoodie and it is just a regular ass screen printed sweatshirt. you can see where they ripped out the tag. my 4frnt t-shirt seems to be really nicely made. still, probably not made in the 4frnt factory, but a good quality shirt.
Oct 4 2005 11:28AM
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Melvs
Posts: 15174 - Karma: 480
our industry needs money to sustain itself. So, instead of going oout and buying that 'element' or 'quicksilver' shirt, why not buy one from a company that is IN THE SKI INDSUTRY. it helps the indsutry out more, and yes, it really does help it out.
Oct 4 2005 11:30AM
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Hctiws_iks
Posts: 2077 - Karma: 25
companies that just make clothing and put nothing back, seem stupid to me. However companies have to start somewhere, and if the show a viable interest, ie help organizing events sponsoring events, ect. i am happy to support them. I mean lok at Siver now, it started off as a small clthing company, but now not only does it make outerwear but it sponsors tons of events, creates events and does numerous other things that makes it one of the more respected companies out there.
Oct 4 2005 11:30AM
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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
(except for maybe siver, which i have some respect for).

you're right, and that's why i wasn't really talking about them. Of all those companies, Siver actually looks/acts professional, does in fact put on a lot of events, and worked with Orage until it could become its own brand altogether. Siver's website is pretty damned legit, and has real pics of all their clothing. Only problem I see with them is that their outerwear looks good, but is kinda lacking in the tech department. Hopefully that'll improve over time.

And yeah, totally right on that buying from brands like Armada, Line, 4FRNT, and Ninthward IS supporting skiing, and serves a purpose. When you buy from those companies, you are keeping afloat companies that ONLY focus on newschool skiing, as opposed to supporting companies like dynastar that don't give a shit. This ensures you will have good skis to buy.
Oct 4 2005 11:36AM
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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
how does buying from some dude's t-shirt company help "the industry"? I don't want to help people that are selling haggard crap. If the same company actually got funding, took out loans, and made something quality, maybe it'd be worth buying, and maybe they'd be worth my support. But getting things screen printed and putting up a half finished website does not really give me confidence that they're going to do anything for the industry, at all. And again, what is this big draw of helping "the indsutry"?
Oct 4 2005 11:41AM
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AmbushClothing
Posts: 1616 - Karma: 202
the real pictures will be up soon enough. Sorry if Ambush Dosent appease you, but at least im trying to support the sport i love an become involved in this great industry. We all need to start somwere and this is were im starting. I have had alot of good reviews so far but negitave reviews are equally as good. All the pictures will be up on collumbus day!! And please, you are supporing skiing if you buy from any Ski lifestyle company. So support the sport you love!! Thank you!
Oct 4 2005 11:43AM
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BobYohan
Posts: 3001 - Karma: 375
yeah I hate it when I'm checking out a website to see what the clothes are like and theres just a picture of the graphic. If you arent even going to show me what the finished shirt looks like theres no way im buying it. yes siver is the most legitimate freeskiing company in terms of giving back to the sport, but dont get too down on the smaller companies just yet. everyone has to start somewhere and im sure they will be active in events and videos once given the chance.
Oct 4 2005 11:43AM
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dom_uk
Posts: 1560 - Karma: 12
ambush went on about how good these jerseys were, and they sounded alrite, but they release the site after 2 months of telling us about it, and then hav jack shit to show for it, not impreseed
Oct 4 2005 11:53AM
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Schoening
Posts: 14332 - Karma: 1,268
at least there out trying....give them credit for that
Oct 4 2005 11:54AM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
I find I like Armada softgoods more than anyone else's, including Siver. Although Siver stuff's alright too. I'm wearing it now.
Oct 4 2005 11:57AM
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oO~sKiErGirL~Oo
Posts: 2314 - Karma: 21
while it does suck when a company hasn't got the funds to immediately be designing their own clothing from scratch- you have to start somewhere in order to make enough capital to design the clothes completely.

I don't know if you have ever designed and produced your own clothing line, but there is a lot involved in mass producing self-designed articles of clothing. If you are getting them custom made somewhere in your own country, there are minimum numbers you have to order, plus they are very expensive and same goes for getting your product made in a place like Thailand where you have to order even larger numbers.

A small business owner can't take a risk that large right off the bat because there is too much to lose, so it is reasonable to start off as cheaply as possible and work your way toward completely custom clothing. You'll notice the quality curve that most small companies are on, and the ones that really suck disappear, and the ones with potential keep growing until they are consistently presenting you with endless options of really nice clothing.

So I'd say at least give Ambush a chance and watch them develop before you go talking garbage about them while they are trying to make a name for themselves.
Oct 4 2005 12:25PM
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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
just because you make a statement does not make it true. I'm a consumer, and if I want a new hooded sweatshirt, I want a really nice one, because they are expensive, and I don't buy many. Now, if Ambush (or any similiar company) offers a plain vanilla sweatshirt with a logo, and I can buy a skate or snowboard hoodie with lots of nice features, maybe a softer or mesh inner liner, nicer pull flaps on the hood, etc, why should I spend any money on the inferior product?

Are you saying the benefits of feeling as if I supported skiing supposed to outweigh the benefits of the nicer hoodie?
Oct 4 2005 12:37PM
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threejay
Posts: 2584 - Karma: 15
i just got this years armada combo zip hoodie and the thing is top quality. The armada is stitched, and the background is screen print...super thick and comfy too...
Oct 4 2005 12:38PM
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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
I disagree. I think you should either save the money yourself, find investors, or get loans. If you actually think your company will be profitable, and have some data to show you might be right, this shouldn't be a problem.
Oct 4 2005 12:41PM
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AmbushClothing
Posts: 1616 - Karma: 202
i never said anything about how good the jerseys are. I said im making custom jerseys and everyone got excited. Just Wait a week and watch! They are coming!!! And it is ALOT of money to actually design your own clothing, and i didnot have that much. and i dont under stand why that is holding people back from supporting a ski clothing company. A tag? man....
Oct 4 2005 12:53PM
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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
because if you didn't design or make any clothing, you aren't a clothing company, you're a picture making company.
Oct 4 2005 1:02PM
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freerider54
Posts: 387 - Karma: 14
Then come with it Cork. Yes you are a consumer and that is great. So am I. But if I am unhappy with a product I just don´t buy it. If you think you have the stones to show projected capital gains to V.C., then anti up, dude. I´d be psyched to buy from a ski company who does all of the wonderful things you´re talking about. The skate industry has boat loads of money to throw in R and D. Skiing really doesn´t. This is no secret. But if you think you can run with it, get out of the cheap seats and do it. Otherwise your recycling the obvious. Of course that´s just my opinion. I could be wrong.
Oct 4 2005 1:02PM
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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
i'm not saying i'm going to start a ski clothing company, far from it. I've said it over and over, but my point is just that I'm sick of companies making sub par products compared to what else is out there, and instead of stepping it up, just constantly trying to shove it down kids throats that they have some patriotic duty to buy their shit if they are a skier.
Oct 4 2005 1:08PM
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altaeric84
Posts: 410 - Karma: 10
I still dont get how suppourting ambush is suppourting skiing? Just because you like to ski?
Oct 4 2005 1:34PM
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Phrosty
Posts: 9956 - Karma: 18
siver is an older company compared to ambush and sublux. I don't remember if siver was putiing on events and what not their first year.
Oct 4 2005 1:38PM
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JackBach
Posts: 4155 - Karma: -5
Did you ever think that if you gave them money they might not have to make "haggard crap?" They might actually have the resources to improve their product if we help them during their beginning stages. We need to support them NOW so they GROW.
Not everyone (not very many at all, actually) can afford to compete with a brand like Quicksiler right out of gate.

If we don't support them, who will?

Plus, all you kids trying to be original should buy "core" cause then you can boost your little egos and make yourself feel better cause you're wearing a t shirt no one else has.

See, everyone wins!
Oct 4 2005 1:44PM
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SmoKinSkier
Posts: 5501 - Karma: 20
The way i see it u got to start somewhere yes quiksilver makes sick gear but it easnt always they way they had to start sumwhere!!! And now all the money thats pumped into them goes to tons of designers to make sicker shit.

So go out and buy those without supporting our industry and if we were all that shallow it would never amount to a damn thing!!
Oct 4 2005 1:44PM
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Dakoulas
Posts: 2894 - Karma: 40
I highly doubt that any of the companies you mentioned in the Pac Sun stores were putting out that qualtiy of products when they first started. In order for a company to grow it needs to start somewhere. Hell Oakley started off makign dirt bike grips, just dirt bike grips, now look at them. If that isn'ta good enough example then I don't know what is.
Oct 4 2005 1:49PM
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OReJow
Posts: 1739 - Karma: 9
companies like quiksilver started out making board shorts, which is a product that's actually relevant to their sport. that's how you get cred, you start out making something useful for your sport. then you can branch out. most of the skate companies you guys are thinking of started out making skate shoes, or decks or something. not t-shirts and hoodies. the t-shirts and hoodies are an extension to support the brand/image. so if you want to start a ski clothing company, you would have way more credibility, not to mention be way more useful to skiers, if you started making outerwear. then make a hoody. and then skiers will want your hoody, because you are a skiing brand. not a fashion brand. i'm sure all of these start ups would rather be making outerwear anyways.... so sack up and do it. no money? take out a loan. that's business.
Oct 4 2005 2:02PM
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gaberaham
Posts: 640 - Karma: 17
I would have to agree, i am always disapointed by the new companys and their product. I want something that when other people see me wearing it they know i ski, like the orignal dotcom NS hoodie, I liked that, to bad i grew out of it
Oct 4 2005 2:37PM
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CorkWormTurn
Posts: 1724 - Karma: 12
exactly. plus, I'd be totally down with buying a screen printed shirt/hoodie from someone like, level 1 for instance, since their a video company that i'd be supporting by buying their shirt.
Oct 4 2005 2:46PM
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skogenjake
Posts: 6685 - Karma: 511
i thought you were sick of "sub par shit".


armadas stuff is really nice. well my hoodie is. my me gusta tee has like went from black to a greyish black and its weird. the texture just got messed up after a few washes...
Oct 4 2005 3:16PM
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andrewkane
Posts: 364 - Karma: 10
haha "core" companies make me laugh... some are just too "core" to even care about quality. I laugh when my friend gets sponsored and breaks 5 pairs of skis in a season or when hat or shirt companies are run out of a kids room in his parents house, cool dude.
Oct 4 2005 4:00PM
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MattMcGinnis
Posts: 2396 - Karma: 73
you dont start out with a million dollars, you earn it. and rather than bitching about shit here, why dont you do something? it seems as though your philosophy is get a million dollars together and then hire people to do everything for you as you just watch.
Oct 4 2005 4:05PM
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threejay
Posts: 2584 - Karma: 15
who the hell cares..buy what you want to buy...if you want to buy quicksilver then freakin buy quicksilver...if you actually want to change things than change them yourself...stop bitching about it. armadas softgoods are top-quality. sivers stuff is decent...if you remember back in the day like 99-00 siver had like 4 tshirts 2 hoodies a 3/4 sleeve and a few hats...you dont just blow up over night...
Oct 4 2005 4:09PM
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bermbuster49
Posts: 7445 - Karma: 90
dont rag on ambush for trying to start something, yeah maybe the shirts arent awsome, but that doesnt give you the right to bash them for trying.
Oct 4 2005 4:10PM
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Tross
Posts: 951 - Karma: 117
I think the only way for "lifestyle" companies to survive is by promoting skiing through events and supporting new initiatives. Do something for skiing, not just make money by providing a second-rate product. I think Sublux' "for-skiers-by-skiers idea of a clothing line is brilliant. It plays off established respect for the rider and their accomplishments. If the team riders support Sublux, that's where their credibility comes from. Just wait til the team drops. Wait till you see the likes of who supports the brand.
Oct 4 2005 4:14PM
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AmbushClothing
Posts: 1616 - Karma: 202
like, no one has even seen the final product. how do the shirts suck whne noone has seen them? i mean, the tag INSIDE the shirt is gonna make people go ewwww that is fucking ugly. If it looks fly, buy it. Not because the tag, or if its made in thiland. With your help, i can do what everyone thinks is easy. This is the first year, and after this, who knows what can happen. I just need your help. Support a name that is now a part of the ski industry. thanks
Oct 4 2005 4:18PM
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radoripper
Posts: 707 - Karma: 45
if those little companies advertise in a ski mag or video, sponsor a rider (with money), or put on rail jams and other events, they support the industry. that money goes back into the industry and helps progress the sport. if you don't do any of those things you are doing nothing but give kids a reason to claim that they are spancerd. manufacturing your own clothing is very very different game....
Oct 4 2005 4:25PM
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eastAR5
Posts: 15084 - Karma: 730
miles keep it real


good point
Oct 4 2005 4:26PM
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OReJow
Posts: 1739 - Karma: 9
i'm not criticizing any company or piece of clothing specifically... i'm just saying, if you make t-shirts and hoodies, you're a clothing company. if you make t-shirts and hoodies and advertise to skiers, you're a clothing company who advertises to skiers. you're not really a skiing company until you do something that really ties you to the sport. Paul Mitchell sponsors tons of skiing comps, but i don't think anyone calls that shit "skiing shampoo".
Oct 4 2005 4:35PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
well, i would still buy quiksilver, seeings as they just bought rossignol and its affiliates, therefore, im supporting skiing.
Oct 4 2005 4:45PM
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JTK
Posts: 1695 - Karma: 73
where can i get this skiing shampoo? what does the bottle design look like and who's on the team... and ams? what vids are they in? does sarah use it?
Oct 4 2005 4:48PM
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MdanteL
Posts: 1142 - Karma: 16
He's def. got a legit point, but think about it this way man.. if your a kid say me for instance im 16 years old, and i have a lot of creative ideas with clothes for instance. how i would start my company is to begin with the screen printed shirts, meaning make my logo make my own designs and then have them printed.. our indusrty is not at the point yet where someone can start a clothing company at top notch, u need to work ur way up
Oct 4 2005 4:51PM
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3ski6guy0
Posts: 9201 - Karma: 132
dude i agree with you. why should i buy ambush clothing? there is nothing cool about it or anything, nothing different than sublux or even worse...ski punks. siver is dope though
Oct 4 2005 5:21PM
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bob_dole
Posts: 4078 - Karma: 1,580
or you could just wait your turn untill you have some better resources to start out a a coupple levels about jus some shitty screen printed shit...and buddy and i have made our own shirts with shit on it. yea its fun, but you cant claim it as your own company. if anything just wear them as someting cool and fun for youreself, it works out way cheaper than to buy another companies shirt for 25-35 bucks.
Oct 4 2005 5:23PM
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bob_dole
Posts: 4078 - Karma: 1,580
sorry taht l;ast line was supposed to be "company"
Oct 4 2005 5:23PM
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Schoening
Posts: 14332 - Karma: 1,268
i don't think most you guys understand how hard it is to actually start a small company like these. balls and a lot of time
Oct 4 2005 5:35PM
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renojames
Posts: 98 - Karma: 10
WormTurn has a point. Some kid makes a few tees and hoodies and suddenly we're supposed to support this "core" ski company? What does it have to do with skiing at all? There isn't even a skier or anything related to skiing on any of the product. Why should I buy a screen-printed tee that says "Ambush" on it rather than something from Siver, Orage, Line, Armada, Joystick, or any other company that actually makes and does things relevant to the newschool movement?
Oct 4 2005 5:36PM
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*DrewT*
Posts: 7768 - Karma: 481
I can kinda see your point but you're blowing outta proportion. I can understand with the companies that don't do anything for the ski industry but it's more just for the clothing anyways. I support companies who supporst skiing by sponsering events and stuff though. SPX was a sponsor of the ICER big air comp
Oct 4 2005 5:51PM
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skogenjake
Posts: 6685 - Karma: 511
i like the ambush stuff, the logos are cool enough, but i mean how many people know its a skiing thing? it looks like it could be a band shirt. one of my friends, steph, asked me if i got my ninthward shirt at warped tour. this is the same situation. I do think this thread is dumb, and out of porportion. support the guy. in a few years he could be sponsoring orage masters. or ambush masters...
Oct 4 2005 6:18PM
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