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Can skiing go further?

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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22708 - Karma: 76,633
Ok boys and girls... it's intelligent discussion time. That means, no hating, no negativity, no name calling. If you have something to say, you must post it in an intellegent, well-thought out way. Think we can do it?

Skiing's future... In my opinion the sport will grow. However the question is for how long can our segment of the skiing world grow for?

Snowboarding has lots more money than us, because the simple fact is that there isn't as many different factions... a snowboard company has to have pro athletes to sell snowboards..period. Ski companies have Ski Instructors, Racers, Mogul Skiers, Big mountain, Park skiers, etc...

In my mind the future of skiing is for everybody to band together. There's no such thing as a big mountain guy telling a park kid to learn to ski, because they both ralise that they can both ski equally well, it's just a matter of where they live, or what they prefer to do.

Here's another interesting topic: How many tricks left are there to do? Once you've been watching cork 7's for 10 years, will it be tired?



Oct 18 2005 11:26AM
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thatoneguyattyrol
Posts: 1497 - Karma: 14
wow, you have to be seriously devoted to read all of these well thought out replies. Good to see that intelligence lurks on newschoolers more than one might have originally thought, sorry for the hijack.
Oct 18 2005 3:59PM
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lyndon
Posts: 7266 - Karma: 128
skiing is only going to get bigger, and soon earn equal recognition just as snowboarders do.
Oct 18 2005 3:59PM
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Ryno
Posts: 31125 - Karma: 336
i liken them to the Tony Hawk Game...every grab is textbook and held from start to finish
Oct 18 2005 4:16PM
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Ryno
Posts: 31125 - Karma: 336
btw anyone know the song from the teaser?
Oct 18 2005 4:23PM
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twix_182
Posts: 9248 - Karma: 27
poopy in the face.

we needed a token unintelligent guy, and i thought it was my time to shine
Oct 18 2005 4:28PM
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pinner-
Posts: 1398 - Karma: 74
I dont like it when people beak you for where you ski. People from the east in quebec or something dont have the mountains to train on like people from the west do. We should all come together thats how we will grow.

new grabs are in right now I think. You see cork 7s over and over but what makes them different are the grabs
Oct 18 2005 4:41PM
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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22708 - Karma: 76,633
I so agree with you...

I want to see a big air comp that's a 2-hour jam format, and you're judged on your bag of tricks, and rotation is capped at 7.

So like to win, someone would have to do all 4 7's and all 4 3's.

That is the kind of stuff I think we should start to do. Push creativity in competitions, as well as video segments. That way the invidual style of skiers will come though.
Oct 18 2005 4:43PM
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matthasaurusrex
Posts: 5160 - Karma: 185
there should be a little ns jam somewhere like that.....
Oct 18 2005 4:44PM
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pinner-
Posts: 1398 - Karma: 74
^^that would be a good idea but I still like to see cab 10s and shit like that you no-
Oct 18 2005 4:46PM
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$$RivalD$$
Posts: 97 - Karma: 44
I think that we will keep growing, but I don't know for how much longer. I think that the thing that draws people to this sport is the progression of it and at the rate we are going I don't know how much longer it's gonna last, soon people are gonna start fuckin dying...
Oct 18 2005 4:46PM
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JTK
Posts: 1695 - Karma: 73
...and all 4 180s consecutively
Oct 18 2005 4:48PM
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GotamaBCshredder
Posts: 5062 - Karma: 424
progression has a long way to go really. People can fall a long way before they get hurt. Jamie Pierre goes bigger then anyone and he lamnds on his head half the itme and is fine. I think people will start just goin biggger in the BC and park will kinda stay the same. There are alot of things that you ctill don't see. Like BIG shifties and stuff in bios. OR DOUBLE TRICKS, like cork 7 to cork 5. It doesen't ahve to be slow to have style.
Oct 18 2005 4:53PM
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matthasaurusrex
Posts: 5160 - Karma: 185
yea i totally agree with you, im in ontario, whitch mean shit skiing, alright park, but bad skiing. And i hate how people put that against someone, you can ust move away
Oct 18 2005 4:53PM
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oakleyaaa
Posts: 558 - Karma: 23
that shrediquette movie puts across a really good vibe, it shows what its supposed to be, like there all just havin fun, and the tricks just add in more fun and somethin to yell about, also i like how they all have there own "style", like a snowboarder style, in the air and in there clothing, there not all thugged out like a lot of skiers but the also dont all have skin tight stuff like racers, even though i hate to say it, snowboarders are doing a better job at keeping it going than skiers are, one great example is on ns, even though we all ski and love to do it, in the forums there are tons of stupid kids bashing each other, saying there better that everyone, and makin fun of kids who maybe aren't as good, i think we should seriously take a look at snowboarders, they know how to throw down
Oct 18 2005 4:54PM
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thatoneguyattyrol
Posts: 1497 - Karma: 14
thats simple in reference to the comp question....

have a true slopeSTYLE comp for once, anything hucked would be graded as such. A stylie 5 is still the best trick in the book when done right.
Oct 18 2005 5:36PM
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Derelicte
Posts: 300 - Karma: 298
if you have actaully seen shrediquette and not just the trailer you would know its not that great of a vid, most of the big snowboard vids this year are way better. reflection, fast food and shrediquette are all the same movie, same formula, same thing, its getting old.

anyway, i think skiing has only one way to go and that is bigger. i think comps are silly in general, its like an art competition.......cant really happen, i dont see skiing as a competition sport. and there is soo, soo, soo much left to be done in skiing its ridiculous, i dont think we are anywhere near becoming stale. i just think skiing on the highest level (pros) should move in the direction of the mountains, not cities (ie. rails)............but there is soo much left to do
Oct 18 2005 5:42PM
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Derelicte
Posts: 300 - Karma: 298
i definantly dont think that bigger cliffs, rails or new grabs are the future of skiing. as a matter of fact, i think the future is less grabs, more style. the future isn't comps with a spin limit, or new grab variations, or falling off bigger and bigger cliffs (like gotamaBCshred said), the future is having fun on a mountain, in my opinion
Oct 18 2005 5:56PM
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Kendo
Posts: 902 - Karma: 11
im waiting to see someone take one of there skis of while spinning and then putting it back on before they land, if you looks cool i think that will open up alot of doors
Oct 18 2005 6:05PM
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NWFlow
Posts: 1557 - Karma: 61
I agree with most people in regards to progression as far as the sport of skiing is concerned- more tricks in the backcountry and pushing off axis spins in big mountain lines (ex. Dana Flahr) I don't think skiing necessarily needs the large amounts of money and corporate media exposure that snowboarding has. It is better if newschool skiing stays as a "fringe" element of skiing, than it become the skiing establishment with every skier on the mountain looking like the Olenicks. Its way more fun to be part of a rebellion than it is to conform.
Oct 18 2005 6:09PM
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*DrewT*
Posts: 7768 - Karma: 481
The competition scene has a long ways to go still. The back 9 invitational is a huge step though. The main thing about it that I like is that it's rider judged. That's what we need. People who know what they're talking about judging the competitions. That will make the comps based so much more on style than how it is now. It's also an original idea. Competitions need to be more unique instead of all either, slopestyle, big air, pipe or rail jam. I love the concept of this competition

as far as tricks go I don't think there will be a problem with that. Snowboarding hasn't encountered that problem yet. I do think that more creative rails and other features are well on the way. Like in shanghi six I think it was. There was a butter box with a lip at the end with another butter box with a lip at the end to another butter box. I think butter tricks could get much bigger as well. TJ Shillers part in X has 2 nose butter bio 5s. They're super sick

Tricks are gonna start to be taken into the backcountry more than ever to. TBC had a good concept. No park skiing what so ever. All BC booters and urban jibs. That's the way of the future.

FAT SKIS!! skis are getting fatter and fatter. I think eventually 120 tip width will be a typical width for a mostly park ski. and 135-145 a typical pow ski. I hope it gets like that anyways.

One footed grinds will die very soon

tricks on urban rails. 270, 450 ons, switch ups,

big ass gaps inbetween rails.

skiing still has lots of things to progress to. I'm not all to worried
Oct 18 2005 6:24PM
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*DrewT*
Posts: 7768 - Karma: 481
less grabs and more style? You can't have style without a grab. not really anyways
Oct 18 2005 6:26PM
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*DrewT*
Posts: 7768 - Karma: 481
oh yeah and I think a sick idea would be to have a terrain park that's like a run through a city. Picnic tables on end, concrete ledges, benches. Light post stalls, Astro vans to slide the top of, a 1 story building gap... and of course, lots of handrails
Oct 18 2005 6:29PM
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skates_mcfarlin
Posts: 214 - Karma: 10
my idea of where skiing will progress is like what a lot of other people are saying. Back to the mountains. Sure rail and stuff are sick and that but i think thats just a fad. Its so much better to take skiing into the backcountry because thats where it all comes together. Not the park or urban or what have you. Second off people need to stop hating on everything, and stop being so concerned about the image. If someone wants to do a one footed grind let them, if they dont want to use poles let them. It has to become so FREE that people can do as they please. that will encourage progression more then anything.

secondly, this sport will NEVER be as big as snowboarding, never its just not possible. You will get a lot of cross over action like people doin both and seein snowbaording and skiing in the same movie but they will never be equal in popularity. So we need to stop comparing ourselves to them and just let what happens happens.

thirdly, its like everything else. There is a human limit. People can not drop 300ft cliffs without a parachute, or jump acorss like 200ft gaps. Look at what happned to tanner on chads when he fucked up. Shit is just getting to big that its almost becoming that if you dont make this you will die, and thats not cool. No one should ever die skiing. So i think to progress that everything needs to slow down be brought back down a bit and then try to push it there. Switch 10s are cool but they in no way should beat a stylie switch 5 or something like that.

progression lies in the people comming up, not the pros. So what a pro can do something but if the rest of the skiing society cant then thats not really progrssion now is it.
Oct 18 2005 7:37PM
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Spam_Man_1500
Posts: 1358 - Karma: 12
I think skiing will only truely progress/evolve is when they create hoverskis. Then I'm jumping on that bandwagon.
Oct 18 2005 7:45PM
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altaeric84
Posts: 410 - Karma: 10
No, It cant. The pinnacle was in 2001.
Oct 18 2005 8:09PM
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mski
Posts: 4791 - Karma: 3,803
trick will keep going with different styles, i dont think the big mtn. VS. Park feud will ever end.
Oct 18 2005 8:17PM
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QuazBotch
Posts: 3909 - Karma: 223
I'm tired of hearing the word progression.

Anyway, in terms of jump building, there is so much that can be done.

I love watching competitions with those huge hips that launch skiers higher in the air then they travel in distance. How about a 100 foot long jump that only gives you about 8 feet of loft? That would make everything look completely different because of the takeoff and landing angle.

One of my favourite things to do in the spring when hills get bumped up is to find lines through through ruts and moguls where I spend as little time on snow as possible, launching off one bump, landing on another, launching off the next and so on. How about scaling that up to field of 25 foot bumps where the skier/boarder can transfer from bump to bump anyway they can imagine if they have the speed? It would become rythmic.

And then of course there is all the butter/air combinations. How about building a little lip that gives the perfect little amount of kick to get way up on your tips/tails, and then throwing in a stepdown 30 feet after?
Oct 18 2005 8:36PM
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forfun
Posts: 4916 - Karma: 66
STOP SPINNING SWITCH 5s AND CORK 7s OFF OF CHEESE WEDGES!!! it bores me and its in every video. find so more creative backcountry situations
Oct 18 2005 8:51PM
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Derelicte
Posts: 300 - Karma: 298
^yes
Oct 18 2005 9:05PM
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Akmizzatt
Posts: 30 - Karma: 10
shut up bitches
Oct 18 2005 9:06PM
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scofield
Posts: 7973 - Karma: 2,467
After watching Shanghai Six, I submit that it cannot.
Oct 18 2005 9:09PM
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AmbushClothing
Posts: 1616 - Karma: 202
damn you connor, i want that movie
Oct 18 2005 9:55PM
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GrippinGs
Posts: 4960 - Karma: 196
he pretty much summed it up, everyones look toward the obvious "New" shit. hasnt anyone heard wuts old is new again? take for instance the resurrection of the shifty and backflip.
Oct 18 2005 9:59PM
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theORANGEshovel
Posts: 857 - Karma: 99
i havent read anything except for a few things but i think like no style no grab 1440's and big spins will be the future for a while and crazy inverted stuff and like one kids said tricks to rail.....or like a long rail to a cork 540 off it would be sweet hit a rainbow wit tons of speed and then grind and go spin off
Oct 18 2005 10:00PM
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steevner
Posts: 4502 - Karma: 47
More flow is the way to go. I also think new grabs will evolve, like a double tail grab, trough the leges tricks, like a snowboarder does(sry to compare) and most deinitely rail progression. I think if the rails change, the way we ride them will too. Think rail kickers. also grinds like nosepresses and tail presses. maybe a couple 1/4 pipes with coping(rails on the lip) for doin lip tricks/stalls. I see the skiing and skiing environment evolving


SKI FREE OR DIE
Oct 18 2005 10:01PM
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twintipteles
Posts: 2954 - Karma: 13
In all likelihood, our oil-based economy will either have crashed or will be extremely different in 30 years, so i think that the progression of skiing will largely come to a halt as the face of society as we know it changes drastically.
Oct 18 2005 10:09PM
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Gorilla.Steeze
Posts: 2215 - Karma: 43
^yea thats true
cause a lot of people wont have a lot of maney to spend on their free time which would = less skiing :-(
Oct 18 2005 10:15PM
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steevner
Posts: 4502 - Karma: 47
or everyone moves within walking distance of the ski hill and doesn't drive anywhere but instead skis all day


SKI FREE OR DIE
Oct 18 2005 10:17PM
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B-Har406
Posts: 2484 - Karma: 6
OK I am not saying in any way that snowboarding looks better or is better than skiing, I am just watching trailors of skiing and boarding and it just looks like snowboards were meant to be in the air. Everything is so fluid and smooth. Sometimes while watching skiing alot of stuff looks hucked, and rushed. By all means I love to watch skiing and love skiing, but what are your thoughts on this, will our sport get to be like this?
Oct 18 2005 10:26PM
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scientist
Posts: 6920 - Karma: 348
this is the most amazing thread that i can remeber, not once has anyone insulted someone else. Im touched. I think the future of skiing is deeply expressed in the eleventh hour. even in the teaser you see new styles both skiing wise and clothing wise. These guys are just having fun. I find that if everyones out there to look like tanner hall (no disrespect at all) the sport will come to a standstill. When you have fun your natural style comes out, which will set all of us apart. I think that this progression has already begun in the snowboarding world, clothing and snowriding wise. Its not so much which grab will be hot next, but more along the lines of who will have the balls to be unique. Of course this would get someone bashed at first (ie. the no pole argument) but this will encourage a unique and seprate approach from everyone. This will be a burden on the clothing companies if everyone has unique styles, and also make judging competitions very difficult. Of course there will still be the trends, but there will always be the little pokes and tweaks that makes each style unique. will be much more variety and
Oct 18 2005 10:36PM
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dez22
Posts: 2959 - Karma: 65
I totally disagree with that scenario. Well first I'd like to say that judging will always be rediculously fucked. How can you say Tanner's best switch cork'd 7 is better then Charles Gagnier's switch cork'd 7? There is no proof.

I think that spinning big is still fun to see, just as much as a slow 5 is to see. I want to see both big spins and slow and stylie spins. So far in today's ski videos I see a mix bag of both, maybe a bit more 7 and aboves but still a fairly good mix.
Oct 19 2005 12:11AM
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Anathema
Posts: 21048 - Karma: 5,061
how can it grow with all the haters we have these days.

ok lets try 1 footed grinds

THATS GAY

lets try bigger spins

so not smooth... GAY

lets try more switch ups on rails

SO FUCKING GAY

how can we do anything if people don't give anything new a chance?

i guess the only way we can progress more is to tweaking out the grabs more and going bigger.. that is, until somebody dies and it's all going to take a step back.
Oct 19 2005 12:17AM
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under_achieved
Posts: 1164 - Karma: 14
^ thats kinda what growth or progression is, in my opinion atleast, somthing new is tried and the majority either accept it or shut it down and we move on.

as far as the origional question I dont know, skiing has come so far in the last few years its hard to say whats in store for the next few. but as with everything it will eventually reach a point of saturation. but for me its not a question of 'can skiing go further' its can I go further, or can I even go, to be honest I dont really care if skiing as a sport stays where it is right now, or even where it was ten years ago. so long as theres a company or two making skis and the snow keeps falling.. I'm happy.
Oct 19 2005 12:33AM
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jibs
Posts: 2529 - Karma: 48
there's no right or wrong progression. Change challenges people, even if it looks dumb. It doesn't even matter if skiing progresses, it's already attained a level that vast majority won't acheive. With no further progression, most of us will still be challenged, and skiing to me, will remain the same.

And to whoever was asking about what kicked off the newschool scene....check out the movie 13. There were newschool flix before this one, but from my perspective, this one truly lit the fires.
Oct 19 2005 2:20AM
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Schnoodle.
Posts: 747 - Karma: 10
I think eventually the limit of how big we can go will be hit. All the tricks will have been done too. I think it will start coming down to style, but also being different. I really respect skiers who can go out and do different stuff, improvising, inventing new grabs, doing tricks on weird urban features which you wouldnt imagine normally being hit. I also see tricks being done both on and off rails/boxes, on real big jumps. I think it will also start to become standard for massive backcountry jumps and gap jumps to be taken off and landed switch, with fatter skis. But as far as size of jumps and tricks, we will hit the limit in the next few years.
Oct 19 2005 2:29AM
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z_hidding
Posts: 153 - Karma: 724
people r saying there isnt many tricks left but look at moto riding. bak a few years b4 the backflip they were thinking the same thing then they got a ton of new tricks wif the backflip and now travis pastrana is throwing doubleback flips. so there will b new tricks no doubt cos in the beginning of skiing i bet they neva new ppl would b doing wat they r doing now, its all about waiting n seeing wat happens
Oct 19 2005 2:39AM
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minty
Posts: 317 - Karma: 11
let's not even think about it. whatever anyone has done so far has set the stones for what is to come. let it play out, the future is freaky altogether. and to whoever says fat skis are the future.....personally i think super fat skis are the biggest fad going.
Oct 19 2005 2:55AM
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FullClip09
Posts: 102 - Karma: 10
I think skiing or our specific segement of skiing will grow through new school specific companies such as 4frnt, Ninthward, armada and what not and siver orage, etc, probably left some out but that is besides the point. Once these companies are able to grow larger and larger. though they are all considered in the ski industry in all reallity they are there own industry. Once they are able to develope the working capital of lets say a salomon or what have you it wont matter about the ski patrolers, instructors etc. It will full on turn into its own industry, as you have already seen companies like Rossi, K2 and Salomon do they pretty much completely are separting this line from there other line of goods. Though they are backed with the company warranties and what not the New School lines seem to almost become there own brand. IE Scratch, 1080 and whatever k2 calls there line (there music inpired line or whatever it is). There is plenty of room for the industry to grow it will just grow possibly in un-expected ways. Yeah corked 7's get old sometimes, but new grabs and jump set ups and what not keep stuff interesting at least for a couple more years.
Oct 19 2005 9:17AM
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pag
Posts: 3412 - Karma: 69
My point is that NS skiing will last until all those extreme sports last. Were are definatly in a trend right here. all the new sports are extreme sports.¸but it will be in many years. We're not gonna die yet. I think that it all depends of wich way we are heading. if we keep our skiing attachement we need to get in the skiing world a full part of what we deserve. I mean by hearing aah you're sliding a rail it'S not skiing we're not at all right now in the same world as recreational skiing or competitive skiing. SO here comes the second option, we are creating our own world more related ot the snowboard/skate/inline industry. Of apparel and softgoods and everything dedicated to there own sport. WIth all those Core compagny right now we are heading in this direction. We won't be like racing and everything we will just be a different part coming from the side like the black sheep just like agressive inline is from recreational inline. There will still be all those huge compagnies but there will be too those compagny who will creates the world of NS skiing the core ones. ANd by this time we will be separated from all other sports and we will have our own style. FOr the tricks and style it will constantly be evolving until it die out. I mean you can't reach the top there is no way it is possible there is 0 sport that is isn't progressing that I know, even bowling is progressing. SO we should stop thinking so much about that and actually do something for this progression. Right now we are all looking to the pros and core compagnies and stuff. BUt it's every skier who is part of this progression like going to buy some clothes off D-structure or Jibji and not going to your local skateshop to buy our winter cloths. it's by creating our own culture that we will grown as our own sport and finaly progress as we want.
Oct 19 2005 9:41AM
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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22708 - Karma: 76,633
I disagree more than you can even imagine.

Why would you limit style to only existing with a grab? That idea takes the "free" out of freeskiing.

I like to say that style is fluidity of motion, and fun to watch. In snowboarding MFM does great no grab tricks that look incredible. Tanner has that no grab cork 3 that's fucking sick in one movie...
Oct 19 2005 12:08PM
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